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Filing a lien after debtor is discharged
charset="ISO-8859-1"
Another contact found the case for me Cortez v. American Wheel (In re
Cortez), 191 BR 174. Recording a previously-unrecorded TD after discharge
is not a violation of the discharge.
- John D. Faucher
On 6/15/10 8:45 AM, "jonhayes6666" wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> I read a case some years ago that said the lien survived and recording the td
> was not a violation of anything. At least I'm sure of the first part. It
> seems to me the judge was Ahart. I don't know if it was his opinion or the
> BAP or what. I remember because I was shocked.
>
> --- In cdcbaa@yahoogroups.com , "David A.
> Tilem" wrote:
>> >
>> > I agree with Dennis that this sounds like a discharge violation to me.
>> >
>> >
>> > David A. Tilem
>> > Certified Bankruptcy Specialist*
>> > Law Offices of David A. Tilem (a debt relief agency)
>> > 206 N. Jackson Street, #201, Glendale, CA 91206
>> > Tel: 818-507-6000 Fax: 818-507-6800
>> >
>> > * Bankruptcy specialist cert. by State Bar of CA Bd of Legal
>> > Specialization.
>> > Business bankruptcy specialist cert. by Amer. Bd. of Certification
>> >
>> >
>> > -----Original Message-----
>> [mailto:cdcbaa@yahoogroups.com ] On Behalf
>> Of
>> > Dennis McGoldrick
>> > Sent: Monday, June 14, 2010 11:36 AM
>> > To: cdcbaa@yahoogroups.com
>> > Subject: Re: [cdcbaa] Filing a lien after debtor is discharged
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > John:
>> >
>> > I would say no, as the lien was unperfected when the debt was discharged.
>> > Cannot record the lien when there is no debt.
>> >
>> > Dennis McGoldrick
>> > 350 S. Crenshaw Bl., #A207B
>> > Torrance, CA 90503
>> >
>> > On Jun 11, 2010, at 4:10 PM, John Faucher > > sbcglobal.net> wrote:
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > Hello listers:
>> > My client, a creditor, has a deed of trust attaching to the debtors'
>> > house. The deed of trust was signed 5 years ago, but never recorded. The
>> > house has no equity, so the trustee is uninterested in it.
>> > Once the debtor gets discharged, and the case is closed, may my client
>> > record the deed of trust? Assume the underlying debt is discharged.
>> > I think "yes," because the unrecorded deed is still a lien against the
>> > property, even if avoidable. Anyone have authority pro or contra?
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > John D. Faucher
>> > Hurlbett & Faucher
>> > 5743 Corsa Ave., Suite 116
>> > Westlake Village, CA 91362
>> > (818) 889-8080
>> > Fax: (805) 367-4154
>> > http://www.hurlbettfaucher.com/
>> >
>> > 3324 State Street, Suite O
>> > Santa Barbara, CA 93105
>> > (805) 963-9111
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > This electronic mail message and any attached files are confidential,
>> > contain information intended for the exclusive use of the individual or
>> > entity to whom it is addressed, and may be legally privileged. If you are
>> > not the intended recipient, please immediately reply to John Faucher (at
>> > 805/963-9111 x103 or john@...) indicating that you received this
>> > message and then delete the message without delay. Thank you for your
>> > cooperation.
>> >
>> > Disclosure Under U.S. IRS Circular 230: The recipient may not use any tax
>> > advice contained in this communication, including any attachments, for the
>> > purpose of avoiding federal tax related penalties or promoting, marketing
>> or
>> > recommending to another party any particular transaction or matter.
>> >
>
>
>
>
>
>>> - John D. Faucher
charset="ISO-8859-1"
Re: [cdcbaa] Re: Filing a lien after debtor is discharged
Another contact found the case for me – Cortez v. American Wheel (In re Cortez), 191 BR 174. Recording a previously-unrecorded TD after discharge is not a violation of the discharge.
- John D. Faucher
On 6/15/10 8:45 AM, "jonhayes6666" <Jhayes@polarisnet.net> wrote:
I read a case some years ago that said the lien survived and recording the td was not a violation of anything. At least I'm sure of the first part. It seems to me the judge was Ahart. I don't know if it was his opinion or the BAP or what. I remember because I was shocked.
The post was migrated from Yahoo.
I read a case some years ago that said the lien survived and recording the td was not a violation of anything. At least I'm sure of the first part. It seems to me the judge was Ahart. I don't know if it was his opinion or the BAP or what. I remember because I was shocked.
>
> I agree with Dennis that this sounds like a discharge violation to me.
>
>
> David A. Tilem
> Certified Bankruptcy Specialist*
> Law Offices of David A. Tilem (a debt relief agency)
> 206 N. Jackson Street, #201, Glendale, CA 91206
> Tel: 818-507-6000 Fax: 818-507-6800
>
> * Bankruptcy specialist cert. by State Bar of CA Bd of Legal
> Specialization.
> Business bankruptcy specialist cert. by Amer. Bd. of Certification
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> Dennis McGoldrick
> Sent: Monday, June 14, 2010 11:36 AM
> To: cdcbaa@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: Re: [cdcbaa] Filing a lien after debtor is discharged
>
>
>
>
>
> John:
>
> I would say no, as the lien was unperfected when the debt was discharged.
> Cannot record the lien when there is no debt.
>
> Dennis McGoldrick
> 350 S. Crenshaw Bl., #A207B
> Torrance, CA 90503
>
> On Jun 11, 2010, at 4:10 PM, John Faucher sbcglobal.net> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> Hello listers:
> My client, a creditor, has a deed of trust attaching to the debtors'
> house. The deed of trust was signed 5 years ago, but never recorded. The
> house has no equity, so the trustee is uninterested in it.
> Once the debtor gets discharged, and the case is closed, may my client
> record the deed of trust? Assume the underlying debt is discharged.
> I think "yes," because the unrecorded deed is still a lien against the
> property, even if avoidable. Anyone have authority pro or contra?
>
>
>
>
> John D. Faucher
> Hurlbett & Faucher
> 5743 Corsa Ave., Suite 116
> Westlake Village, CA 91362
> (818) 889-8080
> Fax: (805) 367-4154
> http://www.hurlbettfaucher.com/
>
> 3324 State Street, Suite O
> Santa Barbara, CA 93105
> (805) 963-9111
>
>
>
> This electronic mail message and any attached files are confidential,
> contain information intended for the exclusive use of the individual or
> entity to whom it is addressed, and may be legally privileged. If you are
> not the intended recipient, please immediately reply to John Faucher (at
> 805/963-9111 x103 or john@...) indicating that you received this
> message and then delete the message without delay. Thank you for your
> cooperation.
>
> Disclosure Under U.S. IRS Circular 230: The recipient may not use any tax
> advice contained in this communication, including any attachments, for the
> purpose of avoiding federal tax related penalties or promoting, marketing or
> recommending to another party any particular transaction or matter.
>
The post was migrated from Yahoo.
Hi:
Not for nothing, but I could swear that my Foreclosure Trustee friend had
warned me that deeds which were notarized more than a year before they are
recorded, when presented at the Los Angeles Co. Recorder's office are
rejected as being stale. But I don't know how that plays into the Civil
Code which talks about unrecorded interests in property are valid as against
the parties and against those that know of the unrecorded deed.
Renay
On Mon, Jun 14, 2010 at 11:32 AM, Dennis McGoldrick wrote:
>
>
> John:
>
> I would say no, as the lien was unperfected when the debt was discharged.
> Cannot record the lien when there is no debt.
>
>
> Dennis McGoldrick
> 350 S. Crenshaw Bl., #A207B
> Torrance, CA 90503
>
> On Jun 11, 2010, at 4:10 PM, John Faucher
> wrote:
>
>
>
> Hello listers:
> My client, a creditor, has a deed of trust attaching to the debtors> house. The deed of trust was signed 5 years ago, but never recorded. The
> house has no equity, so the trustee is uninterested in it.
> Once the debtor gets discharged, and the case is closed, may my client
> record the deed of trust? Assume the underlying debt is discharged.
> I think yes, because the unrecorded deed is still a lien against the
> property, even if avoidable. Anyone have authority pro or contra?
>
> John D. Faucher
> Hurlbett & Faucher
> 5743 Corsa Ave., Suite 116
> Westlake Village, CA 91362
> (818) 889-8080
> Fax: (805) 367-4154
> http://www.hurlbettfaucher.com/
>
> 3324 State Street, Suite O
> Santa Barbara, CA 93105
> (805) 963-9111
>
>
> *This electronic mail message and any attached files are confidential,
> contain information intended for the exclusive use of the individual or
> entity to whom it is addressed, and may be legally privileged. If you are
> not the intended recipient, please immediately reply to John Faucher (at
> 805/963-9111 x103 or john@hf-bklaw.com) indicating that you received this
> message and then delete the message without delay. Thank you for your
> cooperation.
>
> Disclosure Under U.S. IRS Circular 230: The recipient may not use any tax
> advice contained in this communication, including any attachments, for the
> purpose of avoiding federal tax related penalties or promoting, marketing or
> recommending to another party any particular transaction or matter.
> **
> *
>
>
>
>
R. Grace Rodriguez, Esq.
OFF: (818) 734-7223
CEL: (323) 304-5496
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Hi:Not for nothing, but I could swear that my Foreclosure Trustee friend had warned me that deeds which were notarized more than a year before they are recorded, when presented at the Los Angeles Co. Recorder's office are rejected as being stale. But I don't know how that plays into the Civil Code which talks about unrecorded interests in property are valid as against the parties and against those that know of the unrecorded deed.
RenayOn Mon, Jun 14, 2010 at 11:32 AM, Dennis McGoldrick <easky1@yahoo.com> wrote:
John:I would say no, as the lien was unperfected when the debt was discharged. Cannot record the lien when there is no debt.Dennis McGoldrick350 S. Crenshaw Bl., #A207B
Torrance, CA 90503On Jun 11, 2010, at 4:10 PM, John Faucher <j.d.faucher@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
Hello listers:
tors house. The deed of trust was signed 5 years ago, but never recorded. The house has no equity, so the trustee is uninterested in it.
client record the deed of trust? Assume the underlying debt is discharged.
against the property, even if avoidable. Anyone have authority pro or contra?
John D. Faucher
Hurlbett & Faucher
5743 Corsa Ave., Suite 116
Westlake Village, CA 91362
(818) 889-8080
Fax: (805) 367-4154
The post was migrated from Yahoo.
I agree with Dennis that this sounds like a discharge violation to me.
David A. Tilem
Certified Bankruptcy Specialist*
Law Offices of David A. Tilem (a debt relief agency)
206 N. Jackson Street, #201, Glendale, CA 91206
Tel: 818-507-6000 Fax: 818-507-6800
* Bankruptcy specialist cert. by State Bar of CA Bd of Legal
Specialization.
Dennis McGoldrick
Sent: Monday, June 14, 2010 11:36 AM
To: cdcbaa@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [cdcbaa] Filing a lien after debtor is discharged
John:
I would say no, as the lien was unperfected when the debt was discharged.
Cannot record the lien when there is no debt.
Dennis McGoldrick
350 S. Crenshaw Bl., #A207B
Torrance, CA 90503
On Jun 11, 2010, at 4:10 PM, John Faucher wrote:
Hello listers:
My client, a creditor, has a deed of trust attaching to the debtors
house. The deed of trust was signed 5 years ago, but never recorded. The
house has no equity, so the trustee is uninterested in it.
Once the debtor gets discharged, and the case is closed, may my client
record the deed of trust? Assume the underlying debt is discharged.
I think yes, because the unrecorded deed is still a lien against the
property, even if avoidable. Anyone have authority pro or contra?
John D. Faucher
Hurlbett & Faucher
5743 Corsa Ave., Suite 116
Westlake Village, CA 91362
(818) 889-8080
Fax: (805) 367-4154
http://www.hurlbettfaucher.com/
3324 State Street, Suite O
Santa Barbara, CA 93105
(805) 963-9111
This electronic mail message and any attached files are confidential,
contain information intended for the exclusive use of the individual or
entity to whom it is addressed, and may be legally privileged. If you are
not the intended recipient, please immediately reply to John Faucher (at
805/963-9111 x103 or john@hf-bklaw.com) indicating that you received this
message and then delete the message without delay. Thank you for your
cooperation.
Disclosure Under U.S. IRS Circular 230: The recipient may not use any tax
advice contained in this communication, including any attachments, for the
purpose of avoiding federal tax related penalties or promoting, marketing or
recommending to another party any particular transaction or matter.
Message
I agree with Dennis that
this sounds like a discharge violation to me.
David A.
Tilem
Certified Bankruptcy
Specialist*
The post was migrated from Yahoo.
John:
I would say no, as the lien was unperfected when the debt was
discharged. Cannot record the lien when there is no debt.
Dennis McGoldrick
350 S. Crenshaw Bl., #A207B
Torrance, CA 90503
On Jun 11, 2010, at 4:10 PM, John Faucher
wrote:
> Hello listers:
> My client, a creditor, has a deed of trust attaching to the
> debtors house. The deed of trust was signed 5 years ago, but never
> recorded. The house has no equity, so the trustee is uninterested
> in it.
> Once the debtor gets discharged, and the case is closed, may my
> client record the deed of trust? Assume the underlying debt is
> discharged.
> I think yes, because the unrecorded deed is still a lien
> against the property, even if avoidable. Anyone have authority pro
> or contra?
>
> John D. Faucher
> Hurlbett & Faucher
> 5743 Corsa Ave., Suite 116
> Westlake Village, CA 91362
> (818) 889-8080
> Fax: (805) 367-4154
> http://www.hurlbettfaucher.com/
>
> 3324 State Street, Suite O
> Santa Barbara, CA 93105
> (805) 963-9111
>
> This electronic mail message and any attached files are
> confidential, contain information intended for the exclusive use of
> the individual or entity to whom it is addressed, and may be legally
> privileged. If you are not the intended recipient, please
> immediately reply to John Faucher (at 805/963-9111 x103 or john@hf-bklaw.com
> ) indicating that you received this message and then delete the
> message without delay. Thank you for your cooperation.
>
> Disclosure Under U.S. IRS Circular 230: The recipient may not use
> any tax advice contained in this communication, including any
> attachments, for the purpose of avoiding federal tax related
> penalties or promoting, marketing or recommending to another party
> any particular transaction or matter.
>
>
>
>
John:I would say no, as the lien was unperfected when the debt was discharged. Cannot record the lien when there is no debt.Dennis McGoldrick350 S. Crenshaw Bl., #A207BTorrance, CA 90503On Jun 11, 2010, at 4:10 PM, John Faucher <j.d.faucher@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
Hello listers:
My client, a creditor, has a deed of trust attaching to the debtors house. The deed of trust was signed 5 years ago, but never recorded. The house has no equity, so the trustee is uninterested in it.
Once the debtor gets discharged, and the case is closed, may my client record the deed of trust? Assume the underlying debt is discharged.
I think yes, because the unrecorded deed is still a lien against the property, even if avoidable. Anyone have authority pro or contra?
John D. Faucher
Hurlbett & Faucher
5743 Corsa Ave., Suite 116
Westlake Village, CA 91362
(818) 889-8080
Fax: (805) 367-4154
http://www.hurlbettfaucher.com/
3324 State Street, Suite O
Santa Barbara, CA 93105
(805) 963-9111
The post was migrated from Yahoo.
John:
I would say no, as the lien was unperfected when the debt was
discharged. Cannot record the lien when there is no debt.
Dennis McGoldrick
350 S. Crenshaw Bl., #A207B
Torrance, CA 90503
On Jun 11, 2010, at 4:10 PM, John Faucher
wrote:
> Hello listers:
> My client, a creditor, has a deed of trust attaching to the
> debtors house. The deed of trust was signed 5 years ago, but never
> recorded. The house has no equity, so the trustee is uninterested
> in it.
> Once the debtor gets discharged, and the case is closed, may my
> client record the deed of trust? Assume the underlying debt is
> discharged.
> I think yes, because the unrecorded deed is still a lien
> against the property, even if avoidable. Anyone have authority pro
> or contra?
>
> John D. Faucher
> Hurlbett & Faucher
> 5743 Corsa Ave., Suite 116
> Westlake Village, CA 91362
> (818) 889-8080
> Fax: (805) 367-4154
> http://www.hurlbettfaucher.com/
>
> 3324 State Street, Suite O
> Santa Barbara, CA 93105
> (805) 963-9111
>
> This electronic mail message and any attached files are
> confidential, contain information intended for the exclusive use of
> the individual or entity to whom it is addressed, and may be legally
> privileged. If you are not the intended recipient, please
> immediately reply to John Faucher (at 805/963-9111 x103 or john@hf-bklaw.com
> ) indicating that you received this message and then delete the
> message without delay. Thank you for your cooperation.
>
> Disclosure Under U.S. IRS Circular 230: The recipient may not use
> any tax advice contained in this communication, including any
> attachments, for the purpose of avoiding federal tax related
> penalties or promoting, marketing or recommending to another party
> any particular transaction or matter.
>
>
>
>
John:I would say no, as the lien was unperfected when the debt was discharged. Cannot record the lien when there is no debt.Dennis McGoldrick350 S. Crenshaw Bl., #A207BTorrance, CA 90503On Jun 11, 2010, at 4:10 PM, John Faucher <j.d.faucher@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
Hello listers:
My client, a creditor, has a deed of trust attaching to the debtors house. The deed of trust was signed 5 years ago, but never recorded. The house has no equity, so the trustee is uninterested in it.
Once the debtor gets discharged, and the case is closed, may my client record the deed of trust? Assume the underlying debt is discharged.
I think yes, because the unrecorded deed is still a lien against the property, even if avoidable. Anyone have authority pro or contra?
John D. Faucher
Hurlbett & Faucher
5743 Corsa Ave., Suite 116
Westlake Village, CA 91362
(818) 889-8080
Fax: (805) 367-4154
http://www.hurlbettfaucher.com/
3324 State Street, Suite O
Santa Barbara, CA 93105
(805) 963-9111
The post was migrated from Yahoo.
charset="ISO-8859-1"
Hello listers:
My client, a creditor, has a deed of trust attaching to the debtors
house. The deed of trust was signed 5 years ago, but never recorded. The
house has no equity, so the trustee is uninterested in it.
Once the debtor gets discharged, and the case is closed, may my client
record the deed of trust? Assume the underlying debt is discharged.
I think yes, because the unrecorded deed is still a lien against the
property, even if avoidable. Anyone have authority pro or contra?
>>>> John D. Faucher
>>>> Hurlbett & Faucher
>>>> 5743 Corsa Ave., Suite 116
>>>> Westlake Village, CA 91362
>>>> (818) 889-8080
>>>> Fax: (805) 367-4154
>>>> http://www.hurlbettfaucher.com/
>>>>
>>>> 3324 State Street, Suite O
>>>> Santa Barbara, CA 93105
>>>> (805) 963-9111
This electronic mail message and any attached files are confidential,
contain information intended for the exclusive use of the individual or
entity to whom it is addressed, and may be legally privileged. If you are
not the intended recipient, please immediately reply to John Faucher (at
805/963-9111 x103 or john@hf-bklaw.com) indicating that you received this
message and then delete the message without delay. Thank you for your
cooperation.
Disclosure Under U.S. IRS Circular 230: The recipient may not use any tax
advice contained in this communication, including any attachments, for the
purpose of avoiding federal tax related penalties or promoting, marketing or
recommending to another party any particular transaction or matter.
charset="ISO-8859-1"
Filing a lien after debtor is discharged
Hello listers:
My client, a creditor, has a deed of trust attaching to the debtors’ house. The deed of trust was signed 5 years ago, but never recorded. The house has no equity, so the trustee is uninterested in it.
Once the debtor gets discharged, and the case is closed, may my client record the deed of trust? Assume the underlying debt is discharged.
The post was migrated from Yahoo.