.jpg)
Getting Paid
There is no stay issue. The issue is that (at least theoretically) the debtor's payment of fees to the attorney out of estate funds could be avoidable under Section 549. This problem can be avoided if the court authorizes the fees--Section 549(a)(2)(B) that the Trustee can avoid a postpetition transfer of property of the estate "that is not authorized under this title or by the court."
>
> You do not need court permission to receive fees from a chapter 7 debtor.
> The problem is not the debtor voluntarily paying you, but making a demand
> on a debtor - seeking to collect - from property of the estate. Compare
> this with prohibitions on attorneys receiving fee payments postpetition
> from chapter 13 or 11 debtors without court authorization.
>
> *Link Schrader, Attorney*
>
> Law Office of Link W. Schrader
>
> Mail: P.O. Box 3723, Tustin, CA 92781
>
> Office: 106 W. 4th Street, Suite #308, Santa Ana, CA 92701
>
> Office: (714) 542-5922; Mobile/Text: (310) 413-6924
>
> San Diego: (619) 952-8342; Fax: (310) 878-4158
>
> www.schrader-law.com
>
> ______________________________________________________________________________________________________
>
> *This communication and any files transmitted with it contain information
> which is confidential and may be privileged and exempt from disclosure
> under applicable law. It is intended solely for the use of the individual
> or intended recipient. You are hereby notified that any use, dissemination
> or copying of this communication is strictly prohibited. If you have
> received this communication in error, please notify the sender. Thank you
> for your cooperation.*
>
>
> On Tue, Apr 23, 2013 at 11:24 AM, clifford_bordeaux
> wrote:
>
> > **
> >
> >
> > I haven't had this come up, because in most cases debtor can pay from
> > postpetition earnings, or get help from a third party. But it seems to me
> > that if the debtor is holding prepetition funds which can be (or have been)
> > claimed as exempt, you could have the debtor pay the fees to you, deposit
> > the funds in your client trust account, then seek an order authorizing your
> > fees. If the court denies the motion, you could theoretically be forced to
> > return the fees to the client or turn them over to the trustee, but I don't
> > see why a court would not allow you to receive payment of reasonable
> > attorneys' fees from exempt funds.
> >
> > --- In cdcbaa@yahoogroups.com, Link Schrader wrote:
> > >
> > > I agree with Nick that there is no bar to collecting postpetition fees
> > from
> > > a chapter 7 debtor for postpetition obligations. My answer was wrong on
> > > that point.
> > >
> > > How is this: In a chapter 7 case, there is no bar from collecting a
> > > postpetition obligation from property of the debtor that is not property
> > of
> > > the estate.
> > >
> > > Section 362(a) (3) and (4) serve to bar actions against property of the
> > > estate even if related to postpetition obligations. Section 541 defines
> > > property of the estate. 541(a)(6) excepts "earnings from services
> > > performed by an individual debtor after the commencement of the case",
> > but
> > > acts to collect from rental income received by a chapter 7 debtor would
> > > still be barred considering the first part of 541(a)(6).
> > >
> > > In a chapter 13 case it will be important to look at the confirmed plan.
> > > Section VI of the form Central District Chapter 13 plan states that
> > > "Property of the estate shall not revest in the Debtor until such time"
> > as
> > > discharge, dismissal, or closed without discharge. Since Section
> > > 1306(a)(2) includes "earnings from services performed by the debtor after
> > > the commencement of the case..." then in a Chapter 13 case, 362(a)(3)
> > would
> > > prevent any attempt to collect a debt from a Chapter 13 debtor without
> > > first obtaining relief from stay.
> > >
> > > Regarding disclosure of attorney compensation, wouldn't a postpetition
> > > payment of attorney fees be "made after one year before the date of the
> > > filing of the petition..."?
> > >
> > > Best,
> > >
> > > *Link Schrader, Attorney*
> >
> > >
> > > Law Office of Link W. Schrader
> > >
> > > Mail: P.O. Box 3723, Tustin, CA 92781
> > >
> > > Office: 106 W. 4th Street, Suite #308, Santa Ana, CA 92701
> > >
> > > Office: (714) 542-5922; Mobile/Text: (310) 413-6924
> > >
> > > San Diego: (619) 952-8342; Fax: (310) 878-4158
> > >
> > > www.schrader-law.com
> > >
> > > __________________________________________________________
> > >
> > > *This communication and any files transmitted with it contain information
> >
> > > which is confidential and may be privileged and exempt from disclosure
> > > under applicable law. It is intended solely for the use of the individual
> > > or intended recipient. You are hereby notified that any use,
> > dissemination
> > > or copying of this communication is strictly prohibited. If you have
> > > received this communication in error, please notify the sender. Thank you
> > > for your cooperation.*
> > >
> > >
> > > On Tue, Apr 23, 2013 at 8:48 AM, Larry Webb wrote:
> > >
> > > > **
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Counsel,****
> > > >
> > > > ** **
> >
> > > >
> > > > Thank you for your input. I think I agree with Nick, if the source of
> > the
> > > > post-petition payment is post-petition income. If they had cash in
> > savings
> > > > and claimed an exemption, the cash is in the bankruptcy estate until
> > > > discharge and dismissal; or abandonment, right? ****
> > > >
> > > > ** **
> >
> > > >
> > > > I read the 329 disclosure as prepetition payments "after one year
> > before
> > > > the date of filing of the petition". ****
> > > >
> > > > ** **
> > > >
> > > > ** **
> > > >
> > > > Best regards****
> > > >
> > > > ** **
> > > >
> > > > ** **
> > > >
> > > > Larry Webb****
> > > >
> > > > State Bar of California 229344****
> > > >
> > > > Central District California****
> > > >
> > > > "A Debt Relief Agency"****
> > > >
> > > > Check out my Blog ****
> > > >
> > > > ** **
> > > >
> > > > ** **
> > > >
> > > > Larry@webbklaw. com****
> > > >
> > > > Law Offices of Larry Webb****
> > > >
> > > > 484 Mobil Ste 43****
> > > >
> > > > Camarillo Ca 93010****
> > > >
> > > > ** **
> > > >
> > > > P 805.987.1400****
> > > >
> > > > F 805.987.2866****
> > > >
> > > > C 805.750.2150****
> > > >
> > > > ** **
> > > >
> > > > ** **
> > > >
> > > > *From:* cdcbaa@yahoogroups.com [mailto:cdcbaa@yahoogroups.com] *On
> > Behalf
> > > > Of *Nicholas Gebelt
> > > > *Sent:* Tuesday, April 23, 2013 12:55 AM
> > > > *To:* cdcbaa@yahoogroups.com
> > > > *Cc:* Nicholas Gebelt
> > > > *Subject:* RE: [cdcbaa] Getting Paid****
> > > >
> > > > ** **
> > > >
> > > > ****
> > > >
> > > > Dear Link, ****
> > > >
> > > > ****
> >
> > > >
> > > > Why would the automatic stay prevent the collection of postpetition
> > fees?
> > > > 362(a) prohibits postpetition efforts to collect prepetition debts,
> > but
> > > > it says nothing about the collection of obligations incurred
> > postpetition.
> > > > What is your authority for the stay applying to postpetition debts?****
> > > >
> > > > ****
> > > >
> > > > Nick****
> > > >
> > > > ****
> > > >
> > > > Nicholas Gebelt, Ph.D., J.D.****
> > > >
> > > > Board Certified Bankruptcy Specialist****
> > > >
> > > > ****
> > > >
> > > > [image: Description: cid:image003.jpg@]****
> > > >
> > > > ****
> > > >
> > > > Law Offices of Nicholas Gebelt****
> > > >
> > > > 15150 Hornell Street****
> > > >
> > > > Whittier, CA 90604****
> > > >
> > > > Phone: 562.777.9159****
> > > >
> > > > FAX: 562.946.1365****
> > > >
> > > > Email: ngebelt@; ngebelt@****
> > > >
> > > > Web: www.goodbye2debt.com****
> > > >
> > > > Blog: www.southerncaliforniabankruptcylawblog.com/****
> > > >
> > > > ****
> > > >
> > > > *We are a debt relief agency. We help people file for bankruptcy relief
> > > > under the Bankruptcy Code.*****
> > > >
> > > > ****
> > > >
> > > > *Confidentiality Note*: This e-mail is intended only for the person or
> >
> > > > entity to which it is addressed and may contain information that is
> > > > privileged, confidential, or otherwise protected from disclosure.
> > > > Dissemination, distribution, or copying of this e-mail or the
> > information
> > > > herein by anyone other than the intended recipient, or an employee or
> > agent
> > > > responsible for delivering the message to the intended recipient, is
> > > > prohibited. If you have received this e-mail in error, please notify us
> > > > immediately at 562.777.9159 or e-mail info@ and destroy the
> > > > original message and all copies.****
> > > >
> > > > ****
> > > >
> > > > *Representation Note*: If you have not signed a contract of
> >
> > > > representation, the Law Offices of Nicholas Gebelt do not represent
> > you,
> > > > and this email does not contain any legal advice for you.****
> > > >
> > > > ****
> > > >
> > > > *IRS Circular 230 Disclosure: *In order to comply with the requirements
> >
> > > > imposed by the Internal Revenue Service, we inform you that any U.S.
> > tax
> > > > advice contained in this communication (including any attachments) is
> > not
> > > > intended to be used, and cannot be used, for the purpose of (i)
> > avoiding
> > > > penalties under the Internal Revenue code, or (ii) promoting,
> > marketing, or
> > > > recommending to another party any transaction or matter addressed
> > herein.*
> > > > ***
> > > >
> > > > ****
> > > >
> > > > *From:* cdcbaa@yahoogroups.com [mailto:cdcbaa@yahoogroups.com] *On
> > Behalf
> > > > Of *Link Schrader
> > > > *Sent:* Monday, April 22, 2013 5:58 PM
> > > > *To:* cdcbaa@yahoogroups.com
> > > > *Subject:* Re: [cdcbaa] Getting Paid****
> > > >
> > > > ****
> > > >
> > > > ****
> > > >
> > > > Larry,****
> > > >
> > > > ****
> >
> > > >
> > > > There is not a restriction on a chapter 7 debtor entering into
> > contracts
> > > > and making payments post-petition. While the chapter 7 debtor has the
> > > > benefit of the automatic stay and you could not try and collect
> > prepetition
> > > > debt from the debtor, there is no reason you couldn't say "Hey, you
> > came to
> > > > me. I'll enter into a contract to represent you in your chapter 7 case
> > for
> > > > $xxxx.oo." Just have a written fee agreement, file a substitution of
> > > > attorney and a limited scope of appearance. [Note: the automatic stay
> > > > would prevent you from collecting post-petition fees until the case is
> > > > dismissed or closed. So while hourly fees could be charged, it is a
> > safer
> > > > bet to get a flat-fee up front, or a sufficient retainer.] Also, the
> > > > Disclosure of Attorney Compensation would need to be modified as it
> > covers
> > > > prepetition fees and you'll still have a duty to disclose your
> > compensation
> > > > under section 329.****
> > > >
> > > > ****
> >
> > > >
> > > > I'd be cautious about expecting anything that has been filed
> > previously to
> > > > be correct. If you are charging a flat fee then you'll want to be sure
> > it
> > > > is enough to compensate you for looking over the entire case. ****
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > ****
> > > >
> > > > *Link Schrader, Attorney*****
> > > >
> > > > Law Office of Link W. Schrader****
> > > >
> > > > Mail: P.O. Box 3723, Tustin, CA 92781****
> > > >
> > > > Office: 106 W. 4th Street, Suite #308, Santa Ana, CA 92701****
> > > >
> > > > Office: (714) 542-5922; Mobile/Text: (310) 413-6924****
> > > >
> > > > San Diego: (619) 952-8342; Fax: (310) 878-4158****
> > > >
> > > > www.schrader-law.com****
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > __________________________________________________________
> > > > ****
> > > >
> > > > *This communication and any files transmitted with it contain
> > information
> >
> > > > which is confidential and may be privileged and exempt from disclosure
> > > > under applicable law. It is intended solely for the use of the
> > individual
> > > > or intended recipient. You are hereby notified that any use,
> > dissemination
> > > > or copying of this communication is strictly prohibited. If you have
> > > > received this communication in error, please notify the sender. Thank
> > you
> > > > for your cooperation.*****
> > > >
> > > > ****
> > > >
> > > > On Mon, Apr 22, 2013 at 5:15 PM, Larry Webb wrote:***
> > > > *
> > > >
> > > > ****
> >
> > > >
> > > > CH7 pro se debtor files emergency petition, waits ten days and now
> > wants
> > > > to hire an attorney to bail her out. Assuming no post-petition income,
> > how
> > > > do I get paid? My first inclination is to pass on this one.****
> > > >
> > > > ****
> > > >
> > > > ****
> > > >
> > > > Best regards****
> > > >
> > > > ****
> > > >
> > > > ****
> > > >
> > > > Larry Webb****
> > > >
> > > > State Bar of California 229344****
> > > >
> > > > Central District California****
> > > >
> > > > "A Debt Relief Agency"****
> > > >
> > > > Check out my Blog ****
> > > >
> > > > ****
> > > >
> > > > ****
> > > >
> > > > Larry@webbklaw. com****
> > > >
> > > > Law Offices of Larry Webb****
> > > >
> > > > 484 Mobil Ste 43****
> > > >
> > > > Camarillo Ca 93010****
> > > >
> > > > ****
> > > >
> > > > P 805.987.1400****
> > > >
> > > > F 805.987.2866****
> > > >
> > > > C 805.750.2150****
> > > >
> > > > ****
> > > >
> > > > ****
> > > >
> > > > ****
> > > >
> > > > *Link Schrader, Attorney*****
> > > >
> > > > Law Office of Link W. Schrader****
> > > >
> > > > Mail: P.O. Box 3723, Tustin, CA 92781****
> > > >
> > > > Office: 106 W. 4th Street, Suite #308, Santa Ana,****
> > > >
> > > > CA 92701****
> > > >
> > > > Office: (714) 542-5922; Mobile/Text: (310) 413-6924****
> > > >
> > > > San Diego: (619) 952-8342; Fax: (310) 878-4158****
> > > >
> > > > www.schrader-law.com****
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > __________________________________________________________
> > > > ****
> >
> > > >
> > > > This communication and any files transmitted with it contain
> > information
> > > > which is confidential and may be privileged and exempt from disclosure
> > > > under applicable law. It is intended solely for the use of the
> > individual
> > > > or intended recipient. You are hereby notified that any use,
> > dissemination
> > > > or copying of this communication is strictly prohibited. If you have
> > > > received this communication in error, please notify the sender. Thank
> > you
> > > > for your cooperation.****
> > > >
> > > > ****
> > > >
> > > > ****
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > > --
> > > *Link Schrader, Attorney*
> >
> > > Law Office of Link W. Schrader
> > > Mail: P.O. Box 3723, Tustin, CA 92781
> > > Office: 106 W. 4th Street, Suite #308, Santa Ana,
> > > CA 92701
> > > Office: (714) 542-5922; Mobile/Text: (310) 413-6924
> > > San Diego: (619) 952-8342; Fax: (310) 878-4158
> > > www.schrader-law.com
> > > __________________________________________________________
> > > This communication and any files transmitted with it contain information
> > > which is confidential and may be privileged and exempt from disclosure
> > > under applicable law. It is intended solely for the use of the
> > individual
> > > or intended recipient. You are hereby notified that any use,
> > dissemination
> > > or copying of this communication is strictly prohibited. If you have
> > > received this communication in error, please notify the sender. Thank
> > you
> > > for your cooperation.
> > >
> >
> >
> >
>
> --
> *Link Schrader, Attorney*
> Law Office of Link W. Schrader
> Mail: P.O. Box 3723, Tustin, CA 92781
> Office: 106 W. 4th Street, Suite #308, Santa Ana,
> CA 92701
> Office: (714) 542-5922; Mobile/Text: (310) 413-6924
> San Diego: (619) 952-8342; Fax: (310) 878-4158
> www.schrader-law.com
> ______________________________________________________________________________________________________
> This communication and any files transmitted with it contain information> which is confidential and may be privileged and exempt from disclosure
> under applicable law. It is intended solely for the use of the individual
> or intended recipient. You are hereby notified that any use, dissemination
> or copying of this communication is strictly prohibited. If you have
> received this communication in error, please notify the sender. Thank you
> for your cooperation.
>
The post was migrated from Yahoo.
You do not need court permission to receive fees from a chapter 7 debtor.
The problem is not the debtor voluntarily paying you, but making a demand
on a debtor - seeking to collect - from property of the estate. Compare
this with prohibitions on attorneys receiving fee payments postpetition
from chapter 13 or 11 debtors without court authorization.
*Link Schrader, Attorney*
Law Office of Link W. Schrader
Mail: P.O. Box 3723, Tustin, CA 92781
Office: 106 W. 4th Street, Suite #308, Santa Ana, CA 92701
Office: (714) 542-5922; Mobile/Text: (310) 413-6924
San Diego: (619) 952-8342; Fax: (310) 878-4158
www.schrader-law.com
The post was migrated from Yahoo.
I haven't had this come up, because in most cases debtor can pay from postpetition earnings, or get help from a third party. But it seems to me that if the debtor is holding prepetition funds which can be (or have been) claimed as exempt, you could have the debtor pay the fees to you, deposit the funds in your client trust account, then seek an order authorizing your fees. If the court denies the motion, you could theoretically be forced to return the fees to the client or turn them over to the trustee, but I don't see why a court would not allow you to receive payment of reasonable attorneys' fees from exempt funds.
>
> I agree with Nick that there is no bar to collecting postpetition fees from
> a chapter 7 debtor for postpetition obligations. My answer was wrong on
> that point.
>
> How is this: In a chapter 7 case, there is no bar from collecting a
> postpetition obligation from property of the debtor that is not property of
> the estate.
>
> Section 362(a) (3) and (4) serve to bar actions against property of the
> estate even if related to postpetition obligations. Section 541 defines
> property of the estate. 541(a)(6) excepts "earnings from services
> performed by an individual debtor after the commencement of the case", but
> acts to collect from rental income received by a chapter 7 debtor would
> still be barred considering the first part of 541(a)(6).
>
> In a chapter 13 case it will be important to look at the confirmed plan.
> Section VI of the form Central District Chapter 13 plan states that
> "Property of the estate shall not revest in the Debtor until such time" as
> discharge, dismissal, or closed without discharge. Since Section
> 1306(a)(2) includes "earnings from services performed by the debtor after
> the commencement of the case..." then in a Chapter 13 case, 362(a)(3) would
> prevent any attempt to collect a debt from a Chapter 13 debtor without
> first obtaining relief from stay.
>
> Regarding disclosure of attorney compensation, wouldn't a postpetition
> payment of attorney fees be "made after one year before the date of the
> filing of the petition..."?
>
> Best,
>
> *Link Schrader, Attorney*
>
> Law Office of Link W. Schrader
>
> Mail: P.O. Box 3723, Tustin, CA 92781
>
> Office: 106 W. 4th Street, Suite #308, Santa Ana, CA 92701
>
> Office: (714) 542-5922; Mobile/Text: (310) 413-6924
>
> San Diego: (619) 952-8342; Fax: (310) 878-4158
>
> www.schrader-law.com
>
> ______________________________________________________________________________________________________
>
> *This communication and any files transmitted with it contain information
> which is confidential and may be privileged and exempt from disclosure
> under applicable law. It is intended solely for the use of the individual
> or intended recipient. You are hereby notified that any use, dissemination
> or copying of this communication is strictly prohibited. If you have
> received this communication in error, please notify the sender. Thank you
> for your cooperation.*
>
>
> On Tue, Apr 23, 2013 at 8:48 AM, Larry Webb wrote:
>
> > **
> >
> >
> > Counsel,****
> >
> > ** **
> >
> > Thank you for your input. I think I agree with Nick, if the source of the
> > post-petition payment is post-petition income. If they had cash in savings
> > and claimed an exemption, the cash is in the bankruptcy estate until
> > discharge and dismissal; or abandonment, right? ****
> >
> > ** **
> >
> > I read the 329 disclosure as prepetition payments "after one year before
> > the date of filing of the petition". ****
> >
> > ** **
> >
> > ** **
> >
> > Best regards****
> >
> > ** **
> >
> > ** **
> >
> > Larry Webb****
> >
> > State Bar of California 229344****
> >
> > Central District California****
> >
> > "A Debt Relief Agency"****
> >
> > Check out my Blog ****
> >
> > ** **
> >
> > ** **
> >
> > Larry@webbklaw. com****
> >
> > Law Offices of Larry Webb****
> >
> > 484 Mobil Ste 43****
> >
> > Camarillo Ca 93010****
> >
> > ** **
> >
> > P 805.987.1400****
> >
> > F 805.987.2866****
> >
> > C 805.750.2150****
> >
> > ** **
> >
> > ** **
> >
> > *From:* cdcbaa@yahoogroups.com [mailto:cdcbaa@yahoogroups.com] *On Behalf
> > Of *Nicholas Gebelt
> > *Sent:* Tuesday, April 23, 2013 12:55 AM
> > *To:* cdcbaa@yahoogroups.com
> > *Cc:* Nicholas Gebelt
> > *Subject:* RE: [cdcbaa] Getting Paid****
> >
> > ** **
> >
> > ****
> >
> > Dear Link, ****
> >
> > ****
> >
> > Why would the automatic stay prevent the collection of postpetition fees?
> > 362(a) prohibits postpetition efforts to collect prepetition debts, but
> > it says nothing about the collection of obligations incurred postpetition.
> > What is your authority for the stay applying to postpetition debts?****
> >
> > ****
> >
> > Nick****
> >
> > ****
> >
> > Nicholas Gebelt, Ph.D., J.D.****
> >
> > Board Certified Bankruptcy Specialist****
> >
> > ****
> >
> > [image: Description: cid:image003.jpg@...]****
> >
> > ****
> >
> > Law Offices of Nicholas Gebelt****
> >
> > 15150 Hornell Street****
> >
> > Whittier, CA 90604****
> >
> > Phone: 562.777.9159****
> >
> > FAX: 562.946.1365****
> >
> > Email: ngebelt@...; ngebelt@...****
> >
> > Web: www.goodbye2debt.com****
> >
> > Blog: www.southerncaliforniabankruptcylawblog.com/****
> >
> > ****
> >
> > *We are a debt relief agency. We help people file for bankruptcy relief
> > under the Bankruptcy Code.*****
> >
> > ****
> >
> > *Confidentiality Note*: This e-mail is intended only for the person or
> > entity to which it is addressed and may contain information that is
> > privileged, confidential, or otherwise protected from disclosure.
> > Dissemination, distribution, or copying of this e-mail or the information
> > herein by anyone other than the intended recipient, or an employee or agent
> > responsible for delivering the message to the intended recipient, is
> > prohibited. If you have received this e-mail in error, please notify us
> > immediately at 562.777.9159 or e-mail info@... and destroy the
> > original message and all copies.****
> >
> > ****
> >
> > *Representation Note*: If you have not signed a contract of
> > representation, the Law Offices of Nicholas Gebelt do not represent you,
> > and this email does not contain any legal advice for you.****
> >
> > ****
> >
> > *IRS Circular 230 Disclosure: *In order to comply with the requirements
> > imposed by the Internal Revenue Service, we inform you that any U.S. tax
> > advice contained in this communication (including any attachments) is not
> > intended to be used, and cannot be used, for the purpose of (i) avoiding
> > penalties under the Internal Revenue code, or (ii) promoting, marketing, or
> > recommending to another party any transaction or matter addressed herein.*
> > ***
> >
> > ****
> >
> > *From:* cdcbaa@yahoogroups.com [mailto:cdcbaa@yahoogroups.com] *On Behalf
> > Of *Link Schrader
> > *Sent:* Monday, April 22, 2013 5:58 PM
> > *To:* cdcbaa@yahoogroups.com
> > *Subject:* Re: [cdcbaa] Getting Paid****
> >
> > ****
> >
> > ****
> >
> > Larry,****
> >
> > ****
> >
> > There is not a restriction on a chapter 7 debtor entering into contracts
> > and making payments post-petition. While the chapter 7 debtor has the
> > benefit of the automatic stay and you could not try and collect prepetition
> > debt from the debtor, there is no reason you couldn't say "Hey, you came to
> > me. I'll enter into a contract to represent you in your chapter 7 case for
> > $xxxx.oo." Just have a written fee agreement, file a substitution of
> > attorney and a limited scope of appearance. [Note: the automatic stay
> > would prevent you from collecting post-petition fees until the case is
> > dismissed or closed. So while hourly fees could be charged, it is a safer
> > bet to get a flat-fee up front, or a sufficient retainer.] Also, the
> > Disclosure of Attorney Compensation would need to be modified as it covers
> > prepetition fees and you'll still have a duty to disclose your compensation
> > under section 329.****
> >
> > ****
> >
> > I'd be cautious about expecting anything that has been filed previously to
> > be correct. If you are charging a flat fee then you'll want to be sure it
> > is enough to compensate you for looking over the entire case. ****
> >
> >
> > ****
> >
> > *Link Schrader, Attorney*****
> >
> > Law Office of Link W. Schrader****
> >
> > Mail: P.O. Box 3723, Tustin, CA 92781****
> >
> > Office: 106 W. 4th Street, Suite #308, Santa Ana, CA 92701****
> >
> > Office: (714) 542-5922; Mobile/Text: (310) 413-6924****
> >
> > San Diego: (619) 952-8342; Fax: (310) 878-4158****
> >
> > www.schrader-law.com****
> >
> >
> > ______________________________________________________________________________________________________
> > ****
> >
> > *This communication and any files transmitted with it contain information
> > which is confidential and may be privileged and exempt from disclosure
> > under applicable law. It is intended solely for the use of the individual
> > or intended recipient. You are hereby notified that any use, dissemination
> > or copying of this communication is strictly prohibited. If you have
> > received this communication in error, please notify the sender. Thank you
> > for your cooperation.*****
> >
> > ****
> >
> > On Mon, Apr 22, 2013 at 5:15 PM, Larry Webb wrote:***
> > *
> >
> > ****
> >
> > CH7 pro se debtor files emergency petition, waits ten days and now wants
> > to hire an attorney to bail her out. Assuming no post-petition income, how
> > do I get paid? My first inclination is to pass on this one.****
> >
> > ****
> >
> > ****
> >
> > Best regards****
> >
> > ****
> >
> > ****
> >
> > Larry Webb****
> >
> > State Bar of California 229344****
> >
> > Central District California****
> >
> > "A Debt Relief Agency"****
> >
> > Check out my Blog ****
> >
> > ****
> >
> > ****
> >
> > Larry@webbklaw. com****
> >
> > Law Offices of Larry Webb****
> >
> > 484 Mobil Ste 43****
> >
> > Camarillo Ca 93010****
> >
> > ****
> >
> > P 805.987.1400****
> >
> > F 805.987.2866****
> >
> > C 805.750.2150****
> >
> > ****
> >
> > ****
> >
> > ****
> >
> > *Link Schrader, Attorney*****
> >
> > Law Office of Link W. Schrader****
> >
> > Mail: P.O. Box 3723, Tustin, CA 92781****
> >
> > Office: 106 W. 4th Street, Suite #308, Santa Ana,****
> >
> > CA 92701****
> >
> > Office: (714) 542-5922; Mobile/Text: (310) 413-6924****
> >
> > San Diego: (619) 952-8342; Fax: (310) 878-4158****
> >
> > www.schrader-law.com****
> >
> >
> > ______________________________________________________________________________________________________
> > ****
> >
> > This communication and any files transmitted with it contain information
> > which is confidential and may be privileged and exempt from disclosure
> > under applicable law. It is intended solely for the use of the individual
> > or intended recipient. You are hereby notified that any use, dissemination
> > or copying of this communication is strictly prohibited. If you have
> > received this communication in error, please notify the sender. Thank you
> > for your cooperation.****
> >
> > ****
> >
> > ****
> >
> >
> >
>
> --
> *Link Schrader, Attorney*
> Law Office of Link W. Schrader
> Mail: P.O. Box 3723, Tustin, CA 92781
> Office: 106 W. 4th Street, Suite #308, Santa Ana,
> CA 92701
> Office: (714) 542-5922; Mobile/Text: (310) 413-6924
> San Diego: (619) 952-8342; Fax: (310) 878-4158
> www.schrader-law.com
> ______________________________________________________________________________________________________
> This communication and any files transmitted with it contain information> which is confidential and may be privileged and exempt from disclosure
> under applicable law. It is intended solely for the use of the individual
> or intended recipient. You are hereby notified that any use, dissemination
> or copying of this communication is strictly prohibited. If you have
> received this communication in error, please notify the sender. Thank you
> for your cooperation.
>
The post was migrated from Yahoo.
I agree with Nick that there is no bar to collecting postpetition fees from
a chapter 7 debtor for postpetition obligations. My answer was wrong on
that point.
How is this: In a chapter 7 case, there is no bar from collecting a
postpetition obligation from property of the debtor that is not property of
the estate.
Section 362(a) (3) and (4) serve to bar actions against property of the
estate even if related to postpetition obligations. Section 541 defines
property of the estate. 541(a)(6) excepts "earnings from services
performed by an individual debtor after the commencement of the case", but
acts to collect from rental income received by a chapter 7 debtor would
still be barred considering the first part of 541(a)(6).
In a chapter 13 case it will be important to look at the confirmed plan.
Section VI of the form Central District Chapter 13 plan states that
"Property of the estate shall not revest in the Debtor until such time" as
discharge, dismissal, or closed without discharge. Since Section
1306(a)(2) includes "earnings from services performed by the debtor after
the commencement of the case..." then in a Chapter 13 case, 362(a)(3) would
prevent any attempt to collect a debt from a Chapter 13 debtor without
first obtaining relief from stay.
Regarding disclosure of attorney compensation, wouldn't a postpetition
payment of attorney fees be "made after one year before the date of the
filing of the petition..."?
Best,
*Link Schrader, Attorney*
Law Office of Link W. Schrader
Mail: P.O. Box 3723, Tustin, CA 92781
Office: 106 W. 4th Street, Suite #308, Santa Ana, CA 92701
Office: (714) 542-5922; Mobile/Text: (310) 413-6924
San Diego: (619) 952-8342; Fax: (310) 878-4158
www.schrader-law.com
The post was migrated from Yahoo.
Counsel,
Thank you for your input. I think I agree with Nick, if the source of the
post-petition payment is post-petition income. If they had cash in savings
and claimed an exemption, the cash is in the bankruptcy estate until
discharge and dismissal; or abandonment, right?
I read the 329 disclosure as prepetition payments after one year before the
date of filing of the petition.
Best regards
Larry Webb
State Bar of California 229344
Central District California
"A Debt Relief Agency"
Check out my Blog
Larry@webbklaw. com
Law Offices of Larry Webb
484 Mobil Ste 43
Camarillo Ca 93010
P 805.987.1400
F 805.987.2866
C 805.750.2150
The post was migrated from Yahoo.
Dear Link,
Why would the automatic stay prevent the collection of postpetition fees? it says nothing about the collection of obligations incurred postpetition. What is your authority for the stay applying to postpetition debts?
Nick
Nicholas Gebelt, Ph.D., J.D.
Board Certified Bankruptcy Specialist
[Description: cid:image003.jpg@01CC076B.B14D73C0]
Law Offices of Nicholas Gebelt
15150 Hornell Street
Whittier, CA 90604
Phone: 562.777.9159
FAX: 562.946.1365
Email: ngebelt@goodbye2debt.com; ngebelt@gebeltlaw.com
Web: www.goodbye2debt.com
Blog: www.southerncaliforniabankruptcylawblog.com/
We are a debt relief agency. We help people file for bankruptcy relief under the Bankruptcy Code.
Confidentiality Note: This e-mail is intended only for the person or entity to which it is addressed and may contain information that is privileged, confidential, or otherwise protected from disclosure. Dissemination, distribution, or copying of this e-mail or the information herein by anyone other than the intended recipient, or an employee or agent responsible for delivering the message to the intended recipient, is prohibited. If you have received this e-mail in error, please notify us immediately at 562.777.9159 or e-mail info@gebeltlaw.com and destroy the original message and all copies.
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The post was migrated from Yahoo.
Larry,
There is not a restriction on a chapter 7 debtor entering into contracts
and making payments post-petition. While the chapter 7 debtor has the
benefit of the automatic stay and you could not try and collect prepetition
debt from the debtor, there is no reason you couldn't say "Hey, you came to
me. I'll enter into a contract to represent you in your chapter 7 case for
$xxxx.oo." Just have a written fee agreement, file a substitution of
attorney and a limited scope of appearance. [Note: the automatic stay
would prevent you from collecting post-petition fees until the case is
dismissed or closed. So while hourly fees could be charged, it is a safer
bet to get a flat-fee up front, or a sufficient retainer.] Also, the
Disclosure of Attorney Compensation would need to be modified as it covers
prepetition fees and you'll still have a duty to disclose your compensation
under section 329.
I'd be cautious about expecting anything that has been filed previously to
be correct. If you are charging a flat fee then you'll want to be sure it
is enough to compensate you for looking over the entire case.
*Link Schrader, Attorney*
Law Office of Link W. Schrader
Mail: P.O. Box 3723, Tustin, CA 92781
Office: 106 W. 4th Street, Suite #308, Santa Ana, CA 92701
Office: (714) 542-5922; Mobile/Text: (310) 413-6924
San Diego: (619) 952-8342; Fax: (310) 878-4158
www.schrader-law.com
The post was migrated from Yahoo.
If the debtor can't pay ... then there's no money. Unless someone else
foots the bill, that is.
Jay
On Apr 22, 2013 5:15 PM, "Larry Webb" wrote:
> **
>
>
> CH7 pro se debtor files emergency petition, waits ten days and now wants
> to hire an attorney to bail her out. Assuming no post-petition income, how
> do I get paid? My first inclination is to pass on this one.****
>
> ** **
>
> ** **
>
> Best regards****
>
> ** **
>
> ** **
>
> Larry Webb****
>
> State Bar of California 229344****
>
> Central District California****
>
> "A Debt Relief Agency"****
>
> Check out my Blog ****
>
> ** **
>
> ** **
>
> Larry@webbklaw. com****
>
> Law Offices of Larry Webb****
>
> 484 Mobil Ste 43****
>
> Camarillo Ca 93010****
>
> ** **
>
> P 805.987.1400****
>
> F 805.987.2866****
>
> C 805.750.2150****
>
> ** **
>
>
The post was migrated from Yahoo.
CH7 pro se debtor files emergency petition, waits ten days and now wants to
hire an attorney to bail her out. Assuming no post-petition income, how do
I get paid? My first inclination is to pass on this one.
Best regards
Larry Webb
State Bar of California 229344
Central District California
"A Debt Relief Agency"
Check out my Blog
Larry@webbklaw. com
Law Offices of Larry Webb
484 Mobil Ste 43
Camarillo Ca 93010
P 805.987.1400
F 805.987.2866
C 805.750.2150
The post was migrated from Yahoo.