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Relief from stay with eroding equity

Posted: Sun Jan 22, 2012 4:09 pm
by Yahoo Bot

Mellor is still good law. Just Shepardize it.
Go Niners!
Raymond H. Aver, Esquire
Law Offices of Raymond H. Aver
A Professional Corporation
1950 Sawtelle Boulevard
Suite 120
Los Angeles, California 90025
Phone: (310) 571-3511
e-mail: ray@averlaw.com
On Jan 20, 2012, at 9:33 PM, "Dennis" wrote:
You have no choice other than to rely on Mellor. I have had judges tell me that Mellor is over 20 years old and may not be good law. You have to argue Mellor is still the only 9th Cir. precedent, and erosion must bring equity below 20% before erosion is cause for relief from stay.
D
Sent from my iPhone
On Jan 20, 2012, at 9:40 AM, "John D. Faucher" wrote:
Hello All -
Our client owns a stunning house worth between $5 million and $8 million. Chapter 11 plan contemplates sale of the house.
The first trust deed holder has, let's say, $2 million against the house. Client has not made a single payment on the first for two years +; total arrears are $240,000, monthly payment is $12,000, postpetition arrears are $85,000 or so.
The second trust deed has $800,000 on the house. It hasn't been paid either.
Three more trust deeds are junior to the second, for a total of $1.5 million.
The second trust deed is moving for relief from stay, on the basis that it is not adequately protected. We say no, there is adequate protection: even at the lowest valuation of $5 million, the second has an equity cushion of almost $2 million, or 40 percent. Judge Bluebond thinks that they are not adequately protected, because that cushion is eroding: there are no payments made at all.
Rutter says that the equity cushion is all that matters, and that a debtor may keep the property in such a situation. But it cites no cases. We've seen Mellor, which holds that a 20 percent cushion is adequate protection.
The judge now wants from us a brief providing support for the proposition that an equity cushion of 20 percent is sufficient t o protect a junior lienholder even where the senior lien is not being paid, therefore decreasing the value of the junior lienholder's interest in the collateral.
Has anyone else run into this situation, and how did you handle it?
John D. Faucher
Hurlbett & Faucher, LLP
5743 Corsa Ave., Suite 208
Westlake Village, CA 91362
(818) 889-8080
Fax: (805) 367-4154

The post was migrated from Yahoo.

Relief from stay with eroding equity

Posted: Sun Jan 22, 2012 12:26 pm
by Yahoo Bot

Mellor doesn establish a minimum of 20% only that 20% is adequate protections. The two cases relied upon by the Mellor court found 10% and 15% to be adequate protection. Arguably the minimum percentage required for AP is still an open issue.
Peter M. Lively, JD, MBA
The Personal Financial Law Center
A-Bankruptcy-Attorney.com
Culver City (310) 391-2400
To: "cdcbaa@yahoogroups.com"
Sent: Sunday, January 22, 2012 11:58 AM
Subject: Re: [cdcbaa] Relief from stay with eroding equity
Mellor doesn establish a minimum of 20% only that 20% is adequate protections.The two cases relied upon by the Mellor court found 10% and 15% to beadequate protection. Arguablythe minimum percentage required for APisstill an open issue.
Peter M. Lively, JD, MBA
The Personal Financial Law Center
A-Bankruptcy-Attorney.com
Culver City (310) 391-2400
________________________________
To: "cdcbaa@yahoogroups.com"
Cc: Ed Kerns
Sent: Friday, January 20, 2012 9:40 AM
Subject: [cdcbaa] Relief from stay with eroding equity
Hello All -
Our client owns a stunning house worth between $5 million and $8 million. The first trust deed holder has, let's say, $2 million against the house. tal arrears are $240,000, monthly payment is $12,000, postpetition arrears are $85,000 or so.
The second trust deed has $800,000 on the house. It hasn't been paid either.
Three more trust deeds are junior to the second, for a total of $1.5 million.
The second trust deed is moving for relief from stay, on the basis that it is not adequately protected. We say no, there is adequate protection: even at the lowest valuation of $5 million, the second has an equity cushion of almost $2 million, or 40 percent. Judge Bluebond thinks that they are not adequately protected, because that cushion is eroding: there are no payments made at all.
Rutter says that the equity cushion is all that matters, and that a debtor may keep the property in such a situation. But it cites no cases. tection.
The judge now wants from us a brief providing support for the proposition that an equity cushion of 20 percent is sufficient to protect a junior lienholder even where the senior lien is not being paid, therefore decreasing the value of the junior lienholder's interest in the collateral.
Has anyone else run into this situation, and how did you handle it?
John D. FaucherHurlbett & Faucher, LLP
5743 Corsa Ave., Suite 208Westlake Village, CA 91362(818) 889-8080Fax: (805) 367-4154
http://www.hurlbettfaucher.com/
3324 State Street, Suite O
Santa Barbara, CA 93105
(805) 963-9111
This electronic mail message and any attached files are confidential, contain information intended for the exclusive use of the individual or entity to whom it is addressed, and may be legally privileged. If you are not the intended recipient, please immediately reply to John Faucher (at 818/889-8080orjohn@hf-bklaw.com) indicating that you received this message and then delete the message without delay. Thank you for your cooperation.
Disclosure Under U.S. IRS Circular 230: The recipient may not use any tax advice contained in this communication, including any attachments, for the purpose of avoiding federal tax related penalties
or promoting, marketing or recommending to another party any particular transaction or matter.

The post was migrated from Yahoo.

Relief from stay with eroding equity

Posted: Sun Jan 22, 2012 11:58 am
by Yahoo Bot

Mellor doesn establish a minimum of 20% only that 20% is adequate protections.The two cases relied upon by the Mellor court found 10% and 15% to beadequate protection. Arguablythe minimum percentage required for APisstill an open issue.
Peter M. Lively, JD, MBA
The Personal Financial Law Center
A-Bankruptcy-Attorney.com
Culver City (310) 391-2400
________________________________
To: "cdcbaa@yahoogroups.com"
Cc: Ed Kerns
Sent: Friday, January 20, 2012 9:40 AM
Subject: [cdcbaa] Relief from stay with eroding equity
Hello All -
Our client owns a stunning house worth between $5 million and $8 million. The first trust deed holder has, let's say, $2 million against the house. tal arrears are $240,000, monthly payment is $12,000, postpetition arrears are $85,000 or so.
The second trust deed has $800,000 on the house. It hasn't been paid either.
Three more trust deeds are junior to the second, for a total of $1.5 million.
The second trust deed is moving for relief from stay, on the basis that it is not adequately protected. We say no, there is adequate protection: even at the lowest valuation of $5 million, the second has an equity cushion of almost $2 million, or 40 percent. Judge Bluebond thinks that they are not adequately protected, because that cushion is eroding: there are no payments made at all.
Rutter says that the equity cushion is all that matters, and that a debtor may keep the property in such a situation. But it cites no cases. tection.
The judge now wants from us a brief providing support for the proposition that an equity cushion of 20 percent is sufficient to protect a junior lienholder even where the senior lien is not being paid, therefore decreasing the value of the junior lienholder's interest in the collateral.
Has anyone else run into this situation, and how did you handle it?
John D. FaucherHurlbett & Faucher, LLP
5743 Corsa Ave., Suite 208Westlake Village, CA 91362(818) 889-8080Fax: (805) 367-4154
http://www.hurlbettfaucher.com/
3324 State Street, Suite O
Santa Barbara, CA 93105
(805) 963-9111
This electronic mail message and any attached files are confidential, contain information intended for the exclusive use of the individual or entity to whom it is addressed, and may be legally privileged. If you are not the intended recipient, please immediately reply to John Faucher (at 818/889-8080orjohn@hf-bklaw.com) indicating that you received this message and then delete the message without delay. Thank you for your cooperation.
Disclosure Under U.S. IRS Circular 230: The recipient may not use any tax advice contained in this communication, including any attachments, for the purpose of avoiding federal tax related penalties or promoting, marketing or recommending to another party any particular transaction or matter.

The post was migrated from Yahoo.

Relief from stay with eroding equity

Posted: Fri Jan 20, 2012 9:33 pm
by Yahoo Bot

You have no choice other than to rely on Mellor. I have had judges tell me that Mellor is over 20 years old and may not be good law. You have to argue Mellor is still the only 9th Cir. precedent, and erosion must bring equity below 20% before erosion is cause for relief from stay.
D
Sent from my iPhone
On Jan 20, 2012, at 9:40 AM, "John D. Faucher" wrote:
> Hello All -
> Our client owns a stunning house worth between $5 million and $8 million. Chapter 11 plan contemplates sale of the house.
> The first trust deed holder has, let's say, $2 million against the house. Client has not made a single payment on the first for two years +; total arrears are $240,000, monthly payment is $12,000, postpetition arrears are $85,000 or so.
> The second trust deed has $800,000 on the house. It hasn't been paid either.
> Three more trust deeds are junior to the second, for a total of $1.5 million.
>
> The second trust deed is moving for relief from stay, on the basis that it is not adequately protected. We say no, there is adequate protection: even at the lowest valuation of $5 million, the second has an equity cushion of almost $2 million, or 40 percent. Judge Bluebond thinks that they are not adequately protected, because that cushion is eroding: there are no payments made at all.
>
> Rutter says that the equity cushion is all that matters, and that a debtor may keep the property in such a situation. But it cites no cases. We've seen Mellor, which holds that a 20 percent cushion is adequate protection.
>
> The judge now wants from us a brief providing support for the proposition that an equity cushion of 20 percent is sufficient to protect a junior lienholder even where the senior lien is not being paid, therefore decreasing the value of the junior lienholder's interest in the collateral.
>
> Has anyone else run into this situation, and how did you handle it? >
> John D. Faucher
> Hurlbett & Faucher, LLP
> 5743 Corsa Ave., Suite 208
> Westlake Village, CA 91362
> (818) 889-8080
> Fax: (805) 367-4154
> http://www.hurlbettfaucher.com/
>
> 3324 State Street, Suite O
> Santa Barbara, CA 93105
> (805) 963-9111
>
> This electronic mail message and any attached files are confidential, contain information intended for the exclusive use of the individual or entity to whom it is addressed, and may be legally privileged. If you are not the intended recipient, please immediately reply to John Faucher (at 818/889-8080 or john@hf-bklaw.com) indicating that you received this message and then delete the message without delay. Thank you for your cooperation.
>
> Disclosure Under U.S. IRS Circular 230: The recipient may not use any tax advice contained in this communication, including any attachments, for the purpose of avoiding federal tax related penalties or promoting, marketing or recommending to another party any particular transaction or matter.
>
You have no choice other than to rely on Mellor. I have had judges tell me that Mellor is over 20 years old and may not be good law. You have to argue Mellor is still the only 9th Cir. precedent, and erosion must bring equity below 20% before erosion is cause for relief from stay. DSent from my iPhone On Jan 20, 2012, at 9:40 AM, "John D. Faucher" <j.d.faucher@sbcglobal.net> wrote:

Hello All - Our client owns a stunning house worth between $5 million and $8 million. Chapter 11 plan contemplates sale of the house. The first trust deed holder has, let's say, $2 million against the house. Client has not made a single payment on the first for two years +; total arrears are $240,000, monthly payment is $12,000, postpetition arrears are $85,000 or so. The second trust deed has $800,000 on the house. It hasn't been paid either.
The post was migrated from Yahoo.

Relief from stay with eroding equity

Posted: Fri Jan 20, 2012 12:21 pm
by Yahoo Bot

My recollection is that the equity cushion must remain steady. In *United
Savings Association of Texas v. Timbers of Inwood Forest Associates,
Ltd.*484 U.S. 365, 109 S.Ct. 626 (1988) is
the seminal case, but I'm sure you know that. In *Timbers*, even though
the property was worth less than what was owed to the secured creditor, it
was not depreciating in value, which led the S. Ct. to not require adequate
protection payments. A difference in the case you describe is that it is
the second that is asking for relief, but I cannot recall any case at this
moment that says they are not entitled to the same protection.
Giovanni Orantes, Esq.
Orantes Law Firm, P.C.
3435 Wilshire Blvd. Suite 1980
Los Angeles, CA 90010
Tel: (213) 389-4362
Fax: (877) 789-5776
e-mail: go@gobklaw.com
website: www.gobklaw.com
My recollection is that the equity cushion must remain steady. In United
Savings Association of Texas v. Timbers of Inwood Forest Associates, Ltd.
484 U.S. 365, 109 S.Ct. 626 (1988) is the seminal case, but I'm sure you know that. In Timbers, even though the property was worth less than what was
owed to the secured creditor, it was not depreciating in value, which led the S. Ct. to not require adequate protection payments.A difference in the case you describe is that it is the second that is asking for relief, but I cannot recall any case at this moment that says they are not entitled to the same protection.
-- Giovanni Orantes, Esq. Orantes Law Firm, P.C.3435 Wilshire Blvd. Suite 1980
Los Angeles, CA 90010Tel: (213) 389-4362Fax: (877) 789-5776e-mail: go@gobklaw.comwebsite: www.gobklaw.com

The post was migrated from Yahoo.

Relief from stay with eroding equity

Posted: Fri Jan 20, 2012 11:16 am
by Yahoo Bot

I agree with your position based on the code, but have no case law to
support it
On Fri, Jan 20, 2012 at 9:40 AM, John D. Faucher
wrote:
> **
>
>
> Hello All -
> Our client owns a stunning house worth between $5 million and $8 million.
> Chapter 11 plan contemplates sale of the house.
> The first trust deed holder has, let's say, $2 million against the house.
> Client has not made a single payment on the first for two years +; total
> arrears are $240,000, monthly payment is $12,000, postpetition arrears are
> $85,000 or so.
> The second trust deed has $800,000 on the house. It hasn't been paid
> either.
> Three more trust deeds are junior to the second, for a total of $1.5
> million.
>
> The second trust deed is moving for relief from stay, on the basis that it
> is not adequately protected. We say no, there is adequate protection: even
> at the lowest valuation of $5 million, the second has an equity cushion of
> almost $2 million, or 40 percent. Judge Bluebond thinks that they are not
> adequately protected, because that cushion is eroding: there are no
> payments made at all.
>
> Rutter says that the equity cushion is all that matters, and that a debtor
> may keep the property in such a situation. But it cites no cases. We've
> seen Mellor, which holds that a 20 percent cushion is adequate protection.
>
> The judge now wants from us a brief providing support for the proposition
> that an equity cushion of 20 percent is sufficient to protect a junior
> lienholder even where the senior lien is not being paid, therefore
> decreasing the value of the junior lienholder's interest in the collateral.
>
> Has anyone else run into this situation, and how did you handle it?
>
> John D. Faucher
> Hurlbett & Faucher, LLP
> 5743 Corsa Ave., Suite 208
> Westlake Village, CA 91362
> (818) 889-8080
> Fax: (805) 367-4154
> http://www.hurlbettfaucher.com/
>
> 3324 State Street, Suite O
> Santa Barbara, CA 93105
> (805) 963-9111
>
> *This electronic mail message and any attached files are confidential,
> contain information intended for the exclusive use of the individual or
> entity to whom it is addressed, and may be legally privileged. If you are
> not the intended recipient, please immediately reply to John Faucher (at
> 818/889-8080 or john@hf-bklaw.com) indicating that you received this
> message and then delete the message without delay. Thank you for your
> cooperation.
>
> Disclosure Under U.S. IRS Circular 230: The recipient may not use any tax
> advice contained in this communication, including any attachments, for the
> purpose of avoiding federal tax related penalties or promoting, marketing
> or recommending to another party any particular transaction or matter.
> *
>
>
>
Kirk Brennan, esq.
California Law Office, P.C.
calibankrutpcysite.com
CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This e-mail and any attachments are for the
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I agree with your position based on the code, but have no case law to support itOn Fri, Jan 20, 2012 at 9:40 AM, John D. Faucher <j.d.faucher@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
Hello All - Our client owns a stunning house worth between $5 million and $8 million. Chapter 11 plan contemplates sale of the house.
The first trust deed holder has, let's say, $2 million against the house. Client has not made a single payment on the first for two years +; total arrears are $240,000, monthly payment is $12,000, postpetition arrears are $85,000 or so.
The second trust deed has $800,000 on the house. It hasn't been paid either. Three more trust deeds are junior to the second, for a total of $1.5 million.
The second trust deed is moving for relief from stay, on the basis that it is not adequately protected. We say no, there is adequate protection: even at the lowest valuation of $5 million, the second has an equity cushion of almost $2 million, or 40 percent. Judge Bluebond thinks that they are not adequately protected, because that cushion is eroding: there are no payments made at all.
Rutter says that the equity cushion is all that matters, and that a debtor may keep the property in such a situation. But it cites no cases. We've seen Mellor, which holds that a 20 percent cushion is adequate protection.
The judge now wants from us a brief providing support for the proposition that an equity cushion of 20 percent is sufficient to protect a junior lienholder even where the senior lien is not being paid, therefore decreasing the value of the junior lienholder's interest in the collateral.
Has anyone else run into this situation, and how did you handle it?
The post was migrated from Yahoo.

Relief from stay with eroding equity

Posted: Fri Jan 20, 2012 9:40 am
by Yahoo Bot

charset="US-ASCII"
Hello All -
Our client owns a stunning house worth between $5 million and $8 million.
Chapter 11 plan contemplates sale of the house.
The first trust deed holder has, let's say, $2 million against the house.
Client has not made a single payment on the first for two years +; total
arrears are $240,000, monthly payment is $12,000, postpetition arrears are
$85,000 or so.
The second trust deed has $800,000 on the house. It hasn't been paid
either.
Three more trust deeds are junior to the second, for a total of $1.5
million.
The second trust deed is moving for relief from stay, on the basis that it
is not adequately protected. We say no, there is adequate protection: even
at the lowest valuation of $5 million, the second has an equity cushion of
almost $2 million, or 40 percent. Judge Bluebond thinks that they are not
adequately protected, because that cushion is eroding: there are no payments
made at all.
Rutter says that the equity cushion is all that matters, and that a debtor
may keep the property in such a situation. But it cites no cases. We've
seen Mellor, which holds that a 20 percent cushion is adequate protection.
The judge now wants from us a brief providing support for the proposition
that an equity cushion of 20 percent is sufficient to protect a junior
lienholder even where the senior lien is not being paid, therefore
decreasing the value of the junior lienholder's interest in the collateral.
Has anyone else run into this situation, and how did you handle it?
John D. Faucher
Hurlbett & Faucher, LLP
5743 Corsa Ave., Suite 208
Westlake Village, CA 91362
(818) 889-8080
Fax: (805) 367-4154
http://www.hurlbettfaucher.com/
3324 State Street, Suite O
Santa Barbara, CA 93105
(805) 963-9111
This electronic mail message and any attached files are confidential,
contain information intended for the exclusive use of the individual or
entity to whom it is addressed, and may be legally privileged. If you are
not the intended recipient, please immediately reply to John Faucher (at
818/889-8080 or john@hf-bklaw.com )
indicating that you received this message and then delete the message
without delay. Thank you for your cooperation.

Disclosure Under U.S. IRS Circular 230: The recipient may not use any tax
advice contained in this communication, including any attachments, for the
purpose of avoiding federal tax related penalties or promoting, marketing or
recommending to another party any particular transaction or matter.
charset="US-ASCII"
Hello All - Our client owns a stunning house worth between $5 million and $8 million. Chapter 11 plan contemplates sale of the house. The first trust deed holder has, let's say, $2 million against the house. Client has not made a single payment on the first for two years +; total arrears are $240,000, monthly payment is $12,000, postpetition arrears are $85,000 or so. The second trust deed has $800,000 on the house. It hasn't been paid either. Three more trust deeds are junior to the second, for a total of $1.5 million. The second trust deed is moving for relief from stay, on the basis that it is not adequately protected. We say no, there is adequate protection: even at the lowest valuation of $5 million, the second has an equity cushion of almost $2 million, or 40 percent. Judge Bluebond thinks that they are not adequately protected, because that cushion is eroding: there are no payments made at all. Rutter says that the equity cushion is all that matters, and that a debtor may keep the property in such a situation. But it cites no cases. We've seen Mellor, which holds that a 20 percent cushion is adequate protection. The judge now wants from us a brief providing support for the proposition that an equity cushion of 20 percent is sufficient to protect a junior lienholder even where the senior lien is not being paid, therefore decreasing the value of the junior lienholder's interest in the collateral. Has anyone else run into this situation, and how did you handle it? John D. FaucherHurlbett & Faucher, LLP5743 Corsa Ave., Suite 208Westlake Village, CA 91362(818) 889-8080Fax: (805) 367-4154
The post was migrated from Yahoo.