Central District Consumer Bankruptcy Attorney's Association

Thanks. CF
----- Original Message -----
To: cdcbaa@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Thursday, May 12, 2005 12:12 PM
Subject: RE: [cdcbaa] Wells Fargo and Bank of America Freezing Bank Accounts
Yes, I recently had an administrative freeze occur on my client's Wells Fargo bank accounts, where Wells was not a creditor. I believe banks can do so without violating the stay under the In re Strumpf USSC case. The reasoning of the bank is that the money may be property of the estate, and they don't want to monkey around with it, unless they get a release from the Trustee. Apparently, Wells Fargo gets notice of all bankruptcies where an account holder has more than a $5,000.00 balance available. In my case, I showed the Chapter 7 Trustee our exemptions on the account, and then he wrote the bank and asked for the release (I had to write the letter for him and he signed and mailed it). -Mike Chekian
Chekian Law Office
Michael Chekian, Esq.
11400 W. Olympic Blvd. #200
Los Angeles, CA 90064
(310) 390-5529 (Tel.)
(310) 445-8879 (Fax)
mike@cheklaw.com (e-mail)
cheklaw.com (web site)
-----Original Message-----
stingray604
Sent: Wednesday, May 11, 2005 6:29 PM
To: cdcbaa@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [cdcbaa] Wells Fargo and Bank of America Freezing Bank Accounts
I just heard about a few cases today (one of them mine- but I haven't
had a chance to speak with the debtor) where the above banks suddenly
froze the debtor's bank account after getting notice of a BK filing
(In one case, Wells Fargo was NOT even a creditor). When asked under
what authority they were doing this, they simply said that this was
now their "new policy" and that they were "simply following" Section
542 of the Code. The person at Bank of America said that they will
freeze the debtor's account at least for 60 days until they get
a "release from the Trustee".
A couple of other attorneys that my office spoke with today confirmed
that they've had the same experience recently with these 2 banks. We
are in the process of looking into this so-called "new policy"?
Anyone with the same experience or is this a sick joke? I know that
certain financial instituions have setoff rights under state law and I
believe that there is case law suggesting that an 'administrative
hold" on a debtor's bank account pending an MFR is not a stay
violation per se. But in one of the cases I mentioned above, Wells
Fargo was NOT even a creditor. They simply said they were holding the
funds for the trustee as it may be property of the estate in which the
trustee may have an interest.
Comments, anyone?
Yahoo! Groups Links
a.. To visit your group on the web, go to:
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Thanks. CF
----- Original Message -----
From:
Michael Chekian

To: cdcbaa@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Thursday, May 12, 2005 12:12 PM
Subject: RE: [cdcbaa] Wells Fargo and
Bank of America Freezing Bank Accounts



Yes, I recently had an administrative freeze occur on my clients Wells Fargo
bank accounts, where Wells was not a creditor. I believe banks can do so
without violating the stay under the In re Strumpf USSC
case. The reasoning of the bank is that the money may be property
of the estate, and they dont want to monkey around with it, unless they get a
release from the Trustee. Apparently, Wells Fargo gets notice of all
bankruptcies where an account holder has more than a $5,000.00 balance
available. In my case, I showed the Chapter 7 Trustee our exemptions on
the account, and then he wrote the bank and asked for the release (I had to
write the letter for him and he signed and mailed it). Mike
Chekian


Chekian Law Office
Michael Chekian, Esq.
11400 W. Olympic Blvd.
#200
Los Angeles, CA
90064
(310) 390-5529 (Tel.)
(310) 445-8879 (Fax)
mike@cheklaw.com
(e-mail)
cheklaw.com (web
site)

-----Original
Message-----From:
cdcbaa@yahoogroups.com [mailto:cdcbaa@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of stingray604Sent: Wednesday, May 11, 2005 6:29 PMTo:
cdcbaa@yahoogroups.comSubject: [cdcbaa] Wells Fargo and Bank of
America Freezing Bank Accounts

I just heard about a few cases today (one
of them mine- but I haven't had a chance to speak with the debtor) where the above
banks suddenly froze the debtor's
bank account after getting notice of a BK filing (In one case, Wells Fargo was NOT even a creditor).
When asked under what authority
they were doing this, they simply said that this was now their "new policy" and that they were "simply
following" Section 542 of the
Code. The person at Bank of America said that they will
freeze the debtor's account at
least for 60 days until they get a "release from the Trustee".
A couple of other attorneys
that my office spoke with today confirmed that they've had the same experience recently with these 2
banks. We are in the process of looking into this so-called "new
policy"?Anyone with the same
experience or is this a sick joke? I know that certain financial instituions have setoff rights under
state law and I believe that
there is case law suggesting that an 'administrative hold" on a debtor's bank account pending an MFR is not a
stay violation per se. But
in one of the cases I mentioned above, Wells Fargo was NOT even a creditor. They simply said they
were holding the funds for the
trustee as it may be property of the estate in which the
trustee may have an
interest.Comments,

The post was migrated from Yahoo.

Yes. How do they get notice? Carolyn
To:
Sent: Monday, May 16, 2005 4:32 PM
Subject: RE: [cdcbaa] Wells Fargo and Bank of America Freezing Bank Accounts
NOT credit card balance but ANY BANK ACCOUNT IN DEBTOR'S NAME containing
funds of at least $2500.
Again, I know that they can do this under Section 542 but I wasn't aware of
this being standard operating procedure by any bank WHERE THEY ARE NOT EVEN
LISTED AS A CREDITOR.
Carolyn Fergoda
Sent: Thursday, May 12, 2005 6:40 PM
To: cdcbaa@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [cdcbaa] Wells Fargo and Bank of America Freezing Bank Accounts
You mean $2500.00 balance on a B of A credit card? Thanks, CF
To:
Sent: Thursday, May 12, 2005 10:14 AM
Subject: RE: [cdcbaa] Wells Fargo and Bank of America Freezing Bank Accounts
David:
Your thinking comports with mine. Thanks for your reply.
I can understand why they would do it when they ARE listed as a creditor in
an attempt to do a setoff (which In Re Strumpf said was not a stay
violation). I also agree with what you said regarding Section 542 and as to
why they are waiting 60 days (to allow the time given by the Code to Trustee
to object to debtor's exemption).
However, freezing a debtor's account when the bank was NOT even listed as a
creditor (They simply heard about the BK filing) didnt seem to be a regular
bank practice in the past. Why the sudden change of policy?
BTW, Bank of America told our office this morning that they will now do this
on all accounts having over a $2500 balance in any case where they hear of
the account holder's BK filing.
David A. Tilem
Sent: Thursday, May 12, 2005 10:04 AM
To: cdcbaa@yahoogroups.com
Subject: RE: [cdcbaa] Wells Fargo and Bank of America Freezing Bank Accounts
Unfortunately, I think that the banks are correct. The deposits ARE
property of the estate and Section 542 says that the deposits ARE
supposed to be turned over to the Trustee. The 60 days may come from an
attempt to fashion a general rule which comports with the timeline in
Rule 4003 on objections to exemption claims. The authority which says
that a bank can freeze an account for a debt owed to the bank (not the
situation in one of the cases) is nothing less than the 1995 Supreme
Court decision in Citizens Bank v. Strumpf, 116 SCt 286.
David A. Tilem
Certified Bankruptcy Specialist*
Law Offices of David A. Tilem
500 N. Brand Blvd., #460, Glendale, CA 91203
Tel: 818-507-6000 Fax: 818-507-6800
* Bankruptcy specialist cert. by State Bar of CA Bd of Legal
Specialization.
Business bankruptcy specialist cert. by Amer. Bd. of Certification
Of stingray604
Sent: Wednesday, May 11, 2005 6:29 PM
To: cdcbaa@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [cdcbaa] Wells Fargo and Bank of America Freezing Bank Accounts
I just heard about a few cases today (one of them mine- but I haven't
had a chance to speak with the debtor) where the above banks suddenly
froze the debtor's bank account after getting notice of a BK filing
(In one case, Wells Fargo was NOT even a creditor). When asked under
what authority they were doing this, they simply said that this was
now their "new policy" and that they were "simply following" Section
542 of the Code. The person at Bank of America said that they will
freeze the debtor's account at least for 60 days until they get
a "release from the Trustee".
A couple of other attorneys that my office spoke with today confirmed
that they've had the same experience recently with these 2 banks. We
are in the process of looking into this so-called "new policy"?
Anyone with the same experience or is this a sick joke? I know that
certain financial instituions have setoff rights under state law and I
believe that there is case law suggesting that an 'administrative
hold" on a debtor's bank account pending an MFR is not a stay
violation per se. But in one of the cases I mentioned above, Wells
Fargo was NOT even a creditor. They simply said they were holding the
funds for the trustee as it may be property of the estate in which the
trustee may have an interest.
Comments, anyone?
Yahoo! Groups Links
Yahoo! Groups Links
Yahoo! Groups Links
Yahoo! Groups Links
Yahoo! Groups Links

The post was migrated from Yahoo.

NOT credit card balance but ANY BANK ACCOUNT IN DEBTOR'S NAME containing funds of at least $2500.
Again, I know that they can do this under Section 542 but I wasn't aware of this being standard operating procedure by any bank WHERE THEY ARE NOT EVEN LISTED AS A CREDITOR.
arolyn Fergoda
Sent: Thursday, May 12, 2005 6:40 PM
To: cdcbaa@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [cdcbaa] Wells Fargo and Bank of America Freezing Bank Accounts
You mean $2500.00 balance on a B of A credit card? Thanks, CF
To:
Sent: Thursday, May 12, 2005 10:14 AM
Subject: RE: [cdcbaa] Wells Fargo and Bank of America Freezing Bank Accounts
David:
Your thinking comports with mine. Thanks for your reply.
I can understand why they would do it when they ARE listed as a creditor in
an attempt to do a setoff (which In Re Strumpf said was not a stay
violation). I also agree with what you said regarding Section 542 and as to
why they are waiting 60 days (to allow the time given by the Code to Trustee
to object to debtor's exemption).
However, freezing a debtor's account when the bank was NOT even listed as a
creditor (They simply heard about the BK filing) didnt seem to be a regular
bank practice in the past. Why the sudden change of policy?
BTW, Bank of America told our office this morning that they will now do this
on all accounts having over a $2500 balance in any case where they hear of
the account holder's BK filing.
David A. Tilem
Sent: Thursday, May 12, 2005 10:04 AM
To: cdcbaa@yahoogroups.com
Subject: RE: [cdcbaa] Wells Fargo and Bank of America Freezing Bank Accounts
Unfortunately, I think that the banks are correct. The deposits ARE
property of the estate and Section 542 says that the deposits ARE
supposed to be turned over to the Trustee. The 60 days may come from an
attempt to fashion a general rule which comports with the timeline in
Rule 4003 on objections to exemption claims. The authority which says
that a bank can freeze an account for a debt owed to the bank (not the
situation in one of the cases) is nothing less than the 1995 Supreme
Court decision in Citizens Bank v. Strumpf, 116 SCt 286.
David A. Tilem
Certified Bankruptcy Specialist*
Law Offices of David A. Tilem
500 N. Brand Blvd., #460, Glendale, CA 91203
Tel: 818-507-6000 Fax: 818-507-6800
* Bankruptcy specialist cert. by State Bar of CA Bd of Legal
Specialization.
Of stingray604
Sent: Wednesday, May 11, 2005 6:29 PM
To: cdcbaa@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [cdcbaa] Wells Fargo and Bank of America Freezing Bank Accounts
I just heard about a few cases today (one of them mine- but I haven't
had a chance to speak with the debtor) where the above banks suddenly
froze the debtor's bank account after getting notice of a BK filing
(In one case, Wells Fargo was NOT even a creditor). When asked under
what authority they were doing this, they simply said that this was
now their "new policy" and that they were "simply following" Section
542 of the Code. The person at Bank of America said that they will
freeze the debtor's account at least for 60 days until they get
a "release from the Trustee".
A couple of other attorneys that my office spoke with today confirmed
that they've had the same experience recently with these 2 banks. We
are in the process of looking into this so-called "new policy"?
Anyone with the same experience or is this a sick joke? I know that
certain financial instituions have setoff rights under state law and I
believe that there is case law suggesting that an 'administrative
hold" on a debtor's bank account pending an MFR is not a stay
violation per se. But in one of the cases I mentioned above, Wells
Fargo was NOT even a creditor. They simply said they were holding the
funds for the trustee as it may be property of the estate in which the
trustee may have an interest.
Comments, anyone?
Yahoo! Groups Links
Yahoo! Groups Links
Yahoo! Groups Links
Yahoo! Groups Links

The post was migrated from Yahoo.

You mean $2500.00 balance on a B of A credit card? Thanks, CF
To:
Sent: Thursday, May 12, 2005 10:14 AM
Subject: RE: [cdcbaa] Wells Fargo and Bank of America Freezing Bank Accounts
David:
Your thinking comports with mine. Thanks for your reply.
I can understand why they would do it when they ARE listed as a creditor in
an attempt to do a setoff (which In Re Strumpf said was not a stay
violation). I also agree with what you said regarding Section 542 and as to
why they are waiting 60 days (to allow the time given by the Code to Trustee
to object to debtor's exemption).
However, freezing a debtor's account when the bank was NOT even listed as a
creditor (They simply heard about the BK filing) didnt seem to be a regular
bank practice in the past. Why the sudden change of policy?
BTW, Bank of America told our office this morning that they will now do this
on all accounts having over a $2500 balance in any case where they hear of
the account holder's BK filing.
David A. Tilem
Sent: Thursday, May 12, 2005 10:04 AM
To: cdcbaa@yahoogroups.com
Subject: RE: [cdcbaa] Wells Fargo and Bank of America Freezing Bank Accounts
Unfortunately, I think that the banks are correct. The deposits ARE
property of the estate and Section 542 says that the deposits ARE
supposed to be turned over to the Trustee. The 60 days may come from an
attempt to fashion a general rule which comports with the timeline in
Rule 4003 on objections to exemption claims. The authority which says
that a bank can freeze an account for a debt owed to the bank (not the
situation in one of the cases) is nothing less than the 1995 Supreme
Court decision in Citizens Bank v. Strumpf, 116 SCt 286.
David A. Tilem
Certified Bankruptcy Specialist*
Law Offices of David A. Tilem
500 N. Brand Blvd., #460, Glendale, CA 91203
Tel: 818-507-6000 Fax: 818-507-6800
* Bankruptcy specialist cert. by State Bar of CA Bd of Legal
Specialization.
Business bankruptcy specialist cert. by Amer. Bd. of Certification
Of stingray604
Sent: Wednesday, May 11, 2005 6:29 PM
To: cdcbaa@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [cdcbaa] Wells Fargo and Bank of America Freezing Bank Accounts
I just heard about a few cases today (one of them mine- but I haven't
had a chance to speak with the debtor) where the above banks suddenly
froze the debtor's bank account after getting notice of a BK filing
(In one case, Wells Fargo was NOT even a creditor). When asked under
what authority they were doing this, they simply said that this was
now their "new policy" and that they were "simply following" Section
542 of the Code. The person at Bank of America said that they will
freeze the debtor's account at least for 60 days until they get
a "release from the Trustee".
A couple of other attorneys that my office spoke with today confirmed
that they've had the same experience recently with these 2 banks. We
are in the process of looking into this so-called "new policy"?
Anyone with the same experience or is this a sick joke? I know that
certain financial instituions have setoff rights under state law and I
believe that there is case law suggesting that an 'administrative
hold" on a debtor's bank account pending an MFR is not a stay
violation per se. But in one of the cases I mentioned above, Wells
Fargo was NOT even a creditor. They simply said they were holding the
funds for the trustee as it may be property of the estate in which the
trustee may have an interest.
Comments, anyone?
Yahoo! Groups Links
Yahoo! Groups Links
Yahoo! Groups Links

The post was migrated from Yahoo.

Better not happen in a Chapter 13!!!!!!!
Debtor's need that money and of course, property has not fully vested in
the Trustee....

The post was migrated from Yahoo.

Yes, I recently had an administrative freeze occur on my client's
Wells Fargo bank accounts, where Wells was not a creditor. I believe banks
can do so without violating the stay under the In re Strumpf USSC case.
The reasoning of the bank is that the money may be property of the estate,
and they don't want to monkey around with it, unless they get a release from
the Trustee. Apparently, Wells Fargo gets notice of all bankruptcies where
an account holder has more than a $5,000.00 balance available. In my case,
I showed the Chapter 7 Trustee our exemptions on the account, and then he
wrote the bank and asked for the release (I had to write the letter for him
and he signed and mailed it). -Mike Chekian
Chekian Law Office
Michael Chekian, Esq.
11400 W. Olympic Blvd. #200
Los Angeles, CA 90064
(310) 390-5529 (Tel.)
(310) 445-8879 (Fax)
mike@cheklaw.com (e-mail)
cheklaw.com (web site)
stingray604
Sent: Wednesday, May 11, 2005 6:29 PM
To: cdcbaa@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [cdcbaa] Wells Fargo and Bank of America Freezing Bank Accounts
I just heard about a few cases today (one of them mine- but I haven't
had a chance to speak with the debtor) where the above banks suddenly
froze the debtor's bank account after getting notice of a BK filing
(In one case, Wells Fargo was NOT even a creditor). When asked under
what authority they were doing this, they simply said that this was
now their "new policy" and that they were "simply following" Section
542 of the Code. The person at Bank of America said that they will
freeze the debtor's account at least for 60 days until they get
a "release from the Trustee".
A couple of other attorneys that my office spoke with today confirmed
that they've had the same experience recently with these 2 banks. We
are in the process of looking into this so-called "new policy"?
Anyone with the same experience or is this a sick joke? I know that
certain financial instituions have setoff rights under state law and I
believe that there is case law suggesting that an 'administrative
hold" on a debtor's bank account pending an MFR is not a stay
violation per se. But in one of the cases I mentioned above, Wells
Fargo was NOT even a creditor. They simply said they were holding the
funds for the trustee as it may be property of the estate in which the
trustee may have an interest.
Comments, anyone?
_____
Yahoo! Groups Links
* To visit your group on the web, go to:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/cdcbaa/
* To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
cdcbaa-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com

The post was migrated from Yahoo.

David:
Your thinking comports with mine. Thanks for your reply.
I can understand why they would do it when they ARE listed as a creditor in an attempt to do a setoff (which In Re Strumpf said was not a stay violation). I also agree with what you said regarding Section 542 and as to why they are waiting 60 days (to allow the time given by the Code to Trustee to object to debtor's exemption).
However, freezing a debtor's account when the bank was NOT even listed as a creditor (They simply heard about the BK filing) didnt seem to be a regular bank practice in the past. Why the sudden change of policy?
BTW, Bank of America told our office this morning that they will now do this on all accounts having over a $2500 balance in any case where they hear of the account holder's BK filing.
avid A. Tilem
Sent: Thursday, May 12, 2005 10:04 AM
To: cdcbaa@yahoogroups.com
Subject: RE: [cdcbaa] Wells Fargo and Bank of America Freezing Bank Accounts
Unfortunately, I think that the banks are correct. The deposits ARE
property of the estate and Section 542 says that the deposits ARE
supposed to be turned over to the Trustee. The 60 days may come from an
attempt to fashion a general rule which comports with the timeline in
Rule 4003 on objections to exemption claims. The authority which says
that a bank can freeze an account for a debt owed to the bank (not the
situation in one of the cases) is nothing less than the 1995 Supreme
Court decision in Citizens Bank v. Strumpf, 116 SCt 286.
David A. Tilem
Certified Bankruptcy Specialist*
Law Offices of David A. Tilem
500 N. Brand Blvd., #460, Glendale, CA 91203
Tel: 818-507-6000 Fax: 818-507-6800
* Bankruptcy specialist cert. by State Bar of CA Bd of Legal
Specialization.
Of stingray604
Sent: Wednesday, May 11, 2005 6:29 PM
To: cdcbaa@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [cdcbaa] Wells Fargo and Bank of America Freezing Bank Accounts
I just heard about a few cases today (one of them mine- but I haven't
had a chance to speak with the debtor) where the above banks suddenly
froze the debtor's bank account after getting notice of a BK filing
(In one case, Wells Fargo was NOT even a creditor). When asked under
what authority they were doing this, they simply said that this was
now their "new policy" and that they were "simply following" Section
542 of the Code. The person at Bank of America said that they will
freeze the debtor's account at least for 60 days until they get
a "release from the Trustee".
A couple of other attorneys that my office spoke with today confirmed
that they've had the same experience recently with these 2 banks. We
are in the process of looking into this so-called "new policy"?
Anyone with the same experience or is this a sick joke? I know that
certain financial instituions have setoff rights under state law and I
believe that there is case law suggesting that an 'administrative
hold" on a debtor's bank account pending an MFR is not a stay
violation per se. But in one of the cases I mentioned above, Wells
Fargo was NOT even a creditor. They simply said they were holding the
funds for the trustee as it may be property of the estate in which the
trustee may have an interest.
Comments, anyone?
Yahoo! Groups Links
Yahoo! Groups Links

The post was migrated from Yahoo.

I just heard about a few cases today (one of them mine- but I haven't
had a chance to speak with the debtor) where the above banks suddenly
froze the debtor's bank account after getting notice of a BK filing
(In one case, Wells Fargo was NOT even a creditor). When asked under
what authority they were doing this, they simply said that this was
now their "new policy" and that they were "simply following" Section
542 of the Code. The person at Bank of America said that they will
freeze the debtor's account at least for 60 days until they get
a "release from the Trustee".
A couple of other attorneys that my office spoke with today confirmed
that they've had the same experience recently with these 2 banks. We
are in the process of looking into this so-called "new policy"?
Anyone with the same experience or is this a sick joke? I know that
certain financial instituions have setoff rights under state law and I
believe that there is case law suggesting that an 'administrative
hold" on a debtor's bank account pending an MFR is not a stay
violation per se. But in one of the cases I mentioned above, Wells
Fargo was NOT even a creditor. They simply said they were holding the
funds for the trustee as it may be property of the estate in which the
trustee may have an interest.
Comments, anyone?

The post was migrated from Yahoo.