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oil, gas and mineral rights valuation in potential Ch. 13
There was an oil & gas presentation last fall that I missed from having to be out of town. I contacted the lecturer who seems to do a good deal of oil & gas accounting, valuation of working interests, etc.
He may have background on this beyond the first blush thought of simply valuing an income stream. His email address is : peterjmcneil@verizon.net peter j. mcneil
You may want to ask him what he knows about the geographical area where the property is located, whether he has intel about activities there (fractionation, secondary recovery projects, etc) as it may affect production in future.
Guy is super nice and gave me a complete outline of his presentation.
Since he does "working interest" work, he may be connected with an expert on what is "really" happening at the location.
I hope that he can help you.
Curt Harrington
(562) 594-9784
Curt: http://patentax.com/curt/
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Prices are at record highs and have been for about 5 years. My mother has
some rights in TX and OK. They have been paying well for that long, but paid
between substantially less and nothing prior to that. The point is that the
current payout may or may not last, which is a discount factor in
determining value. In addition to the stream of income, the owner gets
periodic lease payments. The leases I deal with for my mother have three
year terms. When that is up, they pay another lump sum for the period of the
lease (which I negotiate by looking at the offer, pulling a multiplier of
1.5 out of my rear and countering with it-they accept and I have no idea
whether we got a good deal or a bad one, only that it was better than the
initial offer) and then royalties for anything they pump out. Some will
stop pumping if prices go down too much because the refining costs are high
due to how "dirty" the crude in that field is.
If you have any questions or concerns please contact me.
Pat
Patrick T. Green
Attorney at Law
1010 E. Union St. Suite 206
Pasadena, CA 91106
Tel: 626-449-8433
Fax: 626-449-0565
Email: pat@fitzgreenlaw.com
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Though he is not an appraiser, Ian Hunter 310-265-6670 is an expert in
evaluating and valuing oil and gas leases.
Lorraine L. Loder
Law Office of Lorraine L. Loder
601 W. Fifth Street, Eighth Floor
Los Angeles, CA 90071
Telephone: 213-623-8774
Fax: 213-802-2649 or 213-623-1409
Email: Lorraine.Loder@LLLoderLaw.com
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If by any chance the debtor is of Native American ancestry be mindful
of the obscure federal nonbankruptcy exemptions under Title 25 that may
exempt such lease interests if they stem from Indian tribal land.
Mark T. Jessee
Law Offices of Mark T. Jessee
"A Debt Relief Agency"
50 W. Hillcrest Drive, Suite 200
Thousand Oaks, CA 91360
(805) 497-5868 (805) 497-5864 (Facsimile)
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On Thu, 12 Apr 2012 17:17:57 +0000, "James T. King" wrote:
In a chapter 13 you have much better control over the valuation as the
trustee has no motivation to do an independent analysis. An appraisal
is always good since you may be responding to a creditors objection.
As Jason says there are numerous factors to take into account in
making that determination of projected value, value to the hypothetical
chapter 7 estate, costs of administration etc. But if you provide some
reliable, thoughtful evaluation of the asset you most likely not face
an objection or contradictory evidence by the trustee.
Behalf Of Jason Wallach
Sent: Thursday, April 12, 2012 10:13 AM
To: cdcbaa@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [cdcbaa] oil, gas and mineral rights valuation in
potential Ch. 13
While I suppose a five times annual income multiplier is as good a
guess as any, there could be factors affecting the "asset" value
including likely depletion, environmental issues, volatility from year
to year, etc. I would ask client to come up with a number, put it on
the schedule as "estimated" and then let trustee try to evaluate the
value, and decide whether it is worth objecting.
Same issue comes up with streams of recording or songwriting royalties.
Jason Wallach
jwallach@gladstonemichel.com
On Apr 12, 2012, at 10:07 AM, Sharon Hughes wrote:
I had a case with such rights. Look back 5 years and averaged.
Chapter 7 trustee
sold the rights as they were not exempted.
Best Regards,
Sharon C. Hughes
Hughes & Dunstan, LLP
21650 Oxnard Street, Suite 1960
Woodland Hill, CA 91367Tel: 818-715-9558x1
Fax: 818-715-9559
Email: schug98@aol.com
A/V rated by The Martindale-Hubbell Law Directory
www.hughesanddunstan.com
-----Original Message-----
To: cdcbaa
Sent: Thu, Apr 12, 2012 9:27 am
Subject: [cdcbaa] oil, gas and mineral rights valuation in potential Ch. 13
Potential client has oil, gas and mineral rights that he
inherited through his deceased parents of which he shares 50% annual
royalties between himself and his surviving sister. He receives on
average $1,000 a month in income and he inherited these rights about a
year ago.
How do you value the fair market value of this asset on Schedule "B" in
a Ch. 13 case.
If in fact valuation should be done via appraisal, does anyone have an
appraiser that is well versed in valuation of oil, gas and mineral
rights. The deed does not specify which particular minerals.
Sincerely,
Lindsey B. Green, Esq.
Gumm & Green, LLP, Attorneys at Law
5743 Corsa Ave., Suite 111
Westlake Village, CA 91362
phone: 818 707 4233
fax: 818 707 4262
e-mail-Lindsey@gummandgreen.com
start="5ldq6pwshlog@webmail.mysuperpageshosting.com"
charsetF-8
p{margin: 0;padding: 0;}If by any chance the debtor is of
Native American ancestry be mindful of the obscure federal nonbankruptcy
exemptions under Title 25 that may exempt such lease interests if they
stem from Indian tribal land.
Mark T. JesseeLaw Offices of Mark T. Jessee"A Debt Relief
Agency"50 W. Hillcrest Drive, Suite 200Thousand Oaks, CA 91360(805)
497-5868 (805) 497-5864 (Facsimile)NOTICE TO RECIPIENT: THIS E-MAIL IS
MEANT FOR ONLY THE INTENDED RECIPIENT OF THE TRANSMISSION, AND THIS
COMMUNICATION IS INTENDED TO BE PRIVILEGED BY LAW. IF YOU RECEIVED THIS E-MAIL
IN ERROR, ANY REVIEW, USE, DISSEMINATION, DISTRIBUTION, OR COPYING OF THIS
E-MAIL IS STRICTLY PROHIBITED. PLEASE NOTIFY US IMMEDIATELY OF THE ERROR BY
RETURN E-MAIL AND PLEASE DELETE THIS MESSAGE FROM YOUR SYSTEM. THANK YOU IN
ADVANCE FOR YOUR COOPERATION.
On Thu, 12 Apr 2012 17:17:57 +0000, "James T. King"
<king@kingobk.com> wrote:
The post was migrated from Yahoo.
Potential client has oil, gas and mineral rights that he inherited through his deceased parents of which he shares 50% annual royalties between himself and his surviving sister. He receives on average $1,000 a month in income and he inherited these rights about a year ago.
How do you value the fair market value of this asset on Schedule "B" in a Ch. 13 case.
If in fact valuation should be done via appraisal, does anyone have an appraiser that is well versed in valuation of oil, gas and mineral rights. The deed does not specify which particular minerals.
Sincerely,
Lindsey B. Green, Esq.
Gumm & Green, LLP, Attorneys at Law
5743 Corsa Ave., Suite 111
Westlake Village, CA 91362
phone: 818 707 4233
fax: 818 707 4262
e-mail-Lindsey@gummandgreen.com
The post was migrated from Yahoo.